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The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

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Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#21

Post by fumar »

mdoms wrote: post #13
codezero wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a fun and interesting way to look at it, thanks! TBH I think you got downvoted just for mentioning it, I don't think what you said is actually that controversial unless you're making a lot of assumptions about _your_ intent in sharing this, which doesn't seem fair.

I'm not surprised by the downvotes haha. I never said I agreed with the things I mentioned - I am by no means one of those right wing people - but it's clear which way the cultural winds are blowing today.

What side of the counter culture position would you have been while MLK was pushing for reform? Would your line "its clear which way the cultural winds are blowing today" align with the prejudice side? I think so. Do you look back and see that movement as an evolution and betterment for all of mankind or do you see it as "winds were blowing the wrong way"? Change is hard and change requires you to acknowledge your line of thinking, beliefs, ethics, all of it may be out dated or no longer the form. Imagine how folks born at the turn of 1900's felt when MLK was popular.

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#22

Post by shakezula »

Animats wrote: post #3

Yet his examples are people who did stuff to get clicks. Arguably, the most effective counterculture in recent times was QAnon. That didn't end well.

It's been very interesting to see counter culture swing to the (arguably far but that part is up for interpretation) right. Terrifying, but nonetheless interesting.

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#23

Post by aidenn0 »

andrepd wrote: post #16
mdoms wrote: post #10

The truth is that today the counter-culture is the right wing dudes (and ladies) who won't be beholden to trigger warnings, won't treat particular words as if they have magical powers and won't try to get you fired if you openly believe that male and female are real concepts. If your cursor is hovering over the downvote button right now then that's natural - counter culture isn't popular. By definition.

That's precisely the irritating image people like that have of themselves, which does not correspond to reality. What does it mean "beholden to trigger warnings"? I'm not sure in which sense you are beholden to something which you likely haven't even encountered outside of internet posts making fun of trigger warnings. What magic words are those? Not saying n*gger in polite company isn't censorship, it's just good ma…

While I don't think the GP post is correct, counter-culture necessarily has bad manners, because manners are all about cultural norms.

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#24

Post by jandrese »

mdoms wrote: post #10

The truth is that today the counter-culture is the right wing dudes (and ladies) who won't be beholden to trigger warnings, won't treat particular words as if they have magical powers and won't try to get you fired if you openly believe that male and female are real concepts. If your cursor is hovering over the downvote button right now then that's natural - counter culture isn't popular. By definition.

I mean if you can't openly express your dominance and superiority over some other group of people is life even worth living?

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#25

Post by mdoms »

fumar wrote: post #21
mdoms wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not surprised by the downvotes haha. I never said I agreed with the things I mentioned - I am by no means one of those right wing people - but it's clear which way the cultural winds are blowing today.

What side of the counter culture position would you have been while MLK was pushing for reform? Would your line "its clear which way the cultural winds are blowing today" align with the prejudice side? I think so. Do you look back and see that movement as an evolution and betterment for all of mankind or do you see it as "winds were blowing the wrong way"? Change is hard and change requires you to acknowledge your li…

I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at here, but I will always side with human rights. I am not American BTW so this little piece of cultural trivia is not especially relevant to me.

> Would your line "its clear which way the cultural winds are blowing today" align with the prejudice side?

??

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#26

Post by high_derivative »

andrepd wrote: post #16
mdoms wrote: post #10

The truth is that today the counter-culture is the right wing dudes (and ladies) who won't be beholden to trigger warnings, won't treat particular words as if they have magical powers and won't try to get you fired if you openly believe that male and female are real concepts. If your cursor is hovering over the downvote button right now then that's natural - counter culture isn't popular. By definition.

That's precisely the irritating image people like that have of themselves, which does not correspond to reality. What does it mean "beholden to trigger warnings"? I'm not sure in which sense you are beholden to something which you likely haven't even encountered outside of internet posts making fun of trigger warnings. What magic words are those? Not saying n*gger in polite company isn't censorship, it's just good ma…

You are conjuring up a lot of straw men here, really proving op's point. Getting fired for not directing a swear word but literally just saying a word in quotation is happening. The 'magical powers' is very much on point. Or do you deny this happened?

https://donaldgmcneiljr1954.medium.com/nytimes-peru-n-word-p...

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#27

Post by [deleted] »

mdoms wrote: post #10

The truth is that today the counter-culture is the right wing dudes (and ladies) who won't be beholden to trigger warnings, won't treat particular words as if they have magical powers and won't try to get you fired if you openly believe that male and female are real concepts. If your cursor is hovering over the downvote button right now then that's natural - counter culture isn't popular. By definition.

[deleted]

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#28

Post by retrac »

helen___keller wrote: post #18

I think this is the biggest takeaway for me: > We saw this dynamic metastasize in the wake of George Floyd’s murder, when well-intentioned claims of “silence is violence” (recalling the powerful 1987 ACT-UP “Silence = Death” campaign) spiraled into calling out individuals with even a small following who hadn’t come forward with a timely public statement of solidarity or remorse. Yet public posts were subject to popul…

> While there may be no "algorithm" controlling the narrative you see on 4chan (or a straightforward and ostensibly fair one on a site like reddit), the content you see (and by extension, the narrative) is shaped by profit motive: From well-compensated marketing teams, to hordes of self-interested proselytizers (see: bitcoin), to propaganda teams looking to influence public opinion

I've realized I have exactly one outlet free of this left. It's an IRC channel I've been in since the 90s. I thought about it and none of us are there for any reason other than that we have a common interest and like each other. No money involved, no names involved, and it's one of the more supportive and insightful communities I've ever found online. We've sometimes wondered why it's such a different community from the other places, and this article articulates why quite well, I think. We're old-timers holding out in a little pocket of what has been almost fully absorbed by corporate social media. I'm sure there are others. And I'm sure they won't tell you where to find them, either.

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#29

Post by bluefirebrand »

everdrive wrote: post #6

Still reading the article, but this is an interesting blurb if nothing else: "To be truly countercultural today, in a time of tech hegemony, one has to, above all, betray the platform, which may come in the form of betraying or divesting from your public online self." I hadn't thought of boycotting much of popular online space as being counter-cultural. It's an interesting thought.

> I hadn't thought of boycotting much of popular online space as being counter-cultural. It's an interesting thought

I think the interesting part is that it's kind of counter-culture but it itself is not really a culture at all. There are no groups (as far as I know) for people who eschew social media. They don't meet up at the pub and talk about it, they don't have any kind of organization, even a loose one. People just kind of decide to wash their hands of Facebook and Instagram and Twitter and such, then go about their lives. I don't think they generally feel a part of some larger culture (or counter-culture)

Maybe I'm wrong about that. To me though it almost seems like a stand-alone complex.

Re: The internet didn’t kill counterculture – you just won’t find it on Instagram

#30

Post by mdoms »

jandrese wrote: post #24
mdoms wrote: post #10

The truth is that today the counter-culture is the right wing dudes (and ladies) who won't be beholden to trigger warnings, won't treat particular words as if they have magical powers and won't try to get you fired if you openly believe that male and female are real concepts. If your cursor is hovering over the downvote button right now then that's natural - counter culture isn't popular. By definition.

I mean if you can't openly express your dominance and superiority over some other group of people is life even worth living?

Counter culture should make you uncomfortable. Otherwise what's it counter to?

By the way, a lot of people here seem to think that the term "counter culture" has positive connotations. It doesn't, necessarily.

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