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Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

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Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#22
post #4

Quick, rough calculations suggest to me that the RTX 3080 is about what you need to turn a profit - based on 200k annual revenue you need 600k in hardware. Three years to pay itself off - about the lifetime of the hardware, my guess. That's if you could find the hardware - and I didn't include stuff like motherboard/rack/etc. If it's that hard to make a profit on the RTX 3080 then I doubt the M1 Mac Mini was ever in…

Really? A 1080 TI still produces a few dollars a day easily.

Can confirm. I’m mining on 2x1080s and 2x2070 Supers, and definitely and easily turn a profit after electricity costs, however, it seems like profit is starting to drop rapidly to the point where I seriously question if it’s worth it. The GPUs run at 56c/120w avg. so it’s not too taxing, but it’s still putting wear on all the hardware, fans, etc.

Selling the cards (at above MSRP) now and putting that straight into BTC would probably turn a better profit long term, albeit, very much a gamble. The mining is definitely getting harder/less profitable and at some point soon (2021?) ETH is changing from PoW to PoS.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#23

I thought the main strengths distinguishing the performance of the M1 were the idle power chips that saved a lot of energy, and the shared CPU/GPU memory. Am I remembering that right? Do either of those things equal better intensive mining efficiency, much over a dedicated traditional rig, where you're flat out all the time and emphasizing GPU?

No, and Apple even tells you that when they indicate the processor is geared toward running simplified AI for applications purposes and not meant for training new models. Mining coins seems clearly more like training new models.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#24
post #2

> Is it worth it? > Um. Not really. At current Ethereum prices (2021-02-26), it generates $0.14 of profit per day. It’s still a profit, but very miniscule. The real question is if it makes more money than it costs in electricity. Apple claims it uses 39 W max. That adds up to 0.936 kWh of electricity per day, which we can approximate at 1 kWh. Electricity prices range from ~4¢ to ~20¢ per kWh in the USA, which means…

Is electricity really that cheap in the USA? The cheapest price I've found for my city here in Germany is like 0,24 EUR. And this is already including a new customer discount and cashback. Not even guaranteed green energy... 0,24 EUR is currently ~0,29 USD. That's 0,29 USD for my cheapest price against your most expensive price with 0,20 USD.

Where I live (southeastern US) it's $0.089/kWh. There's additional taxes on it that make it functionally closer to $0.10. But yeah, fairly cheap.

Which is a good thing because we have electric heat and it's been a very cold month. I'm expecting an about $350 bill.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#25
post #2

> Is it worth it? > Um. Not really. At current Ethereum prices (2021-02-26), it generates $0.14 of profit per day. It’s still a profit, but very miniscule. The real question is if it makes more money than it costs in electricity. Apple claims it uses 39 W max. That adds up to 0.936 kWh of electricity per day, which we can approximate at 1 kWh. Electricity prices range from ~4¢ to ~20¢ per kWh in the USA, which means…

Is electricity really that cheap in the USA? The cheapest price I've found for my city here in Germany is like 0,24 EUR. And this is already including a new customer discount and cashback. Not even guaranteed green energy... 0,24 EUR is currently ~0,29 USD. That's 0,29 USD for my cheapest price against your most expensive price with 0,20 USD.

Yes.

1) The US has good hydro resources (in the northwest where it rains all the time and there are lots of mountains so you have both lots of water and altitude change) as well as nuclear (especially in the long-industrialized northeast) that (mostly) has long been paid for and that we just keep running for cheap. Nuclear is about 19% of our electricity, and it's cheap once it has been built for decades.

2) Lots of cheap wind, especially in the middle of the continent where all the maize and stuff grows.

3) Way better solar resource especially in the south and southwest where it's about twice as much sun as in Germany and with much, MUCH less seasonal impact. See: http://www.sunisthefuture.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Sun...

4) Like Germany (but even more so), LOTS of coal. Over a quarter of the world's recoverable coal reserves. However, we don't even use that much of it anymore. Just the cheapest kind (usually not the crappy lignite stuff that Germany often uses for power) is still used for power. We use much less than half the coal for electricity than we did even 10 years ago. Because...

5) We have a ridiculous. A RIDICULOUS amount of cheap gas right now. Fracking has opened up the spigot. Texas, Pennsylvania, Lousiana, Oklahoma, Ohio, etc, etc. (And Canada produces a bunch that we end up using because they don't have anyone else to sell it to and it's produced a long way from Canada's cities.) We make so much natural gas we export it to Mexico, and are even starting to liquefy it and export it to Europe.

So yeah. While Germany has long relied heavily on imported fossil fuels, the shutdown of nuclear plants hasn't helped. Think of how expensive it is to send natural gas all the way from wherever Russia makes it (Siberia) all the way to Germany and the markup Putin asks for. (and that's roughly a third of Germany's natural gas, IIRC)

And I think the way wind/solar subsidies work in Germany and different than in the US. In Germany, the solar subsidy is paid for by all the ratepayers. That alone is like 4.6 US cents per kWh on top of your electricity. In the US, the solar subsidy is funded as a tax credit which means the cost isn't directly borne by consumers but ends up being paid for or borrowed by the federal government. (Also, having twice as much sun means the same solar panel makes roughly twice as much electricity...) This has the effect of solar actually reducing the cost of electricity in the US while it increases the cost of electricity in Germany for the consumer... which probably is why German companies have been more reluctant to switch to electric cars than you think they would have been.

So yeah. The US has a huge amount of land, so really good solar/wind resources (and decent geothermal while we're at it), a pretty solid hydro and nuclear power situation, and massive amounts of fossil fuel. The US is now actually a net energy exporter. That's why electricity is so cheap.

You can check out good statistics for US energy production and consumption here: https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#26
post #2

> Is it worth it? > Um. Not really. At current Ethereum prices (2021-02-26), it generates $0.14 of profit per day. It’s still a profit, but very miniscule. The real question is if it makes more money than it costs in electricity. Apple claims it uses 39 W max. That adds up to 0.936 kWh of electricity per day, which we can approximate at 1 kWh. Electricity prices range from ~4¢ to ~20¢ per kWh in the USA, which means…

The 39W max draw probably assumes the display is on? Will probably draw less in clamshell mining mode.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#27
post #2

> Is it worth it? > Um. Not really. At current Ethereum prices (2021-02-26), it generates $0.14 of profit per day. It’s still a profit, but very miniscule. The real question is if it makes more money than it costs in electricity. Apple claims it uses 39 W max. That adds up to 0.936 kWh of electricity per day, which we can approximate at 1 kWh. Electricity prices range from ~4¢ to ~20¢ per kWh in the USA, which means…

You can pick up a 50 W solar panel pretty cheap nowadays so compared to the cost of the laptop that's nothing. Hopefully its battery will charge up enough on the extra 11 W to last during the night.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#28
post #4

Quick, rough calculations suggest to me that the RTX 3080 is about what you need to turn a profit - based on 200k annual revenue you need 600k in hardware. Three years to pay itself off - about the lifetime of the hardware, my guess. That's if you could find the hardware - and I didn't include stuff like motherboard/rack/etc. If it's that hard to make a profit on the RTX 3080 then I doubt the M1 Mac Mini was ever in…

With free power? iirc the RTX 3080 draws 200+ W.

I mined Ethereum about 3 years ago using the Nvidia 1060 and they never drew max power. Conversely, you could use nvidia_smi to limit their power draw without making much of an impact on hash rate.

I’d be surprised if it was any different with the current lineup of cards.

It would be really interesting to see what the M1 draws doing this. Probably not much. But then it’s not doing a whole lot of hashing either.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Varies greatly based on state or even county. Hundreds or maybe thousands of utility districts each with a unique set of regulations and resources.

Is there any state or nation wide search for good utility prices? We've got Check24[1] in Germany which basically is a no brainer to find good price for stuff like this. [1] https://www.check24.de/strom/

Not really sure. Most places I've lived we haven't had a ton of options on pricing so haven't dug around.

Re: Mining Ethereum on M1 Mac GPU

#30
It's not crazy, but it's telling the software that it's an intel GPU, and taking into account no optimizations targeted at the GPU's strengths. I could see this becoming more useful if it was coded to apple's GPU characteristics, but I'm not even sure anyone outside of Apple knows what those are right now and how to optimize mining software on their GPU.
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