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I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

dear.mariechatfield.com

21–30 of 102 posts

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#21

I don't know, anecdotally, relationships broke down with me and other stakeholders, and I ended up leaving the company, after I pushed hard for an amazing candidate, the first to ever ace my interviews, whereas said other stakeholders wanted a certain diversity candidate, who while I enjoyed meeting didn't do that well. The funny thing is in SF it's the bro-y white guy CEOs who push the wokeness the hardest. Almost f…

Well I can share my individual perspective as a tall white guy. Sure, I've been through extraordinary struggles and life difficulties in my early adulthood, yet life is still pretty much easy mode just from the privilege.

If you've ever read The Wheel of Time by Robert Jordan, the best way I can describe it is it almost feels like being ta'veren. Even if I'm having an off-day, not performing well, doing the wrong things, saying the wrong things, I still get the results I need/want and it all works out.

If a company rejects me in favor of diversity, even my struggles are already relatively so easy to resolve that it's just like, good for them, I'll go to the countless other opportunities.

Not saying it's right or wrong, but I feel like the last person who needs a champion.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#22
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is rejecting a candidate soley based on race not racial discrimination? This is illegal where I live; it is probably why companies never give interview feedback to the interviewees because they make these illegal hiring decisions behind the scenes but then say “it wasn’t a good fit”.

Racial discrimination is a legal concept. There is no racial discrimination if you lack the following: - evidence - witnesses who are willing to testify - legal action Whether it actually happened or not is irrelevant.

And everyone in the company being Caucasian and Asian doesn’t count :)

Just like the photo of the C-suite of most companies being 99% male doesn’t count as sexism.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#23
post #7

Certain demographics are less inclined towards certain jobs. Does anyone seriously think it's a problem that non-white females are represented at less than 0.1% of deep sea welders? Humans are not all equal in proclivities or even innate abilities. The proposed solution by diversity campaigners is usually some form of discrimination, usually against white and Asian people. An Asian male has a much, much higher bar to…

Are you implying that this:"Humans are not all equal in proclivities or even innate abilities,"

is the cause of this: "Certain demographics are less inclined towards certain jobs"?

If so, I would be interested in what sources inform this opinion.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#24
post #12

I would hate to be a minority or woman in Silicon Valley--even if you're qualified, many of your colleagues would presume you "don't deserve" to be there (see the James Damore saga).

I did see the "James Damore saga", and it has nothing to do with "deserving to be there".

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#25
post #7

Certain demographics are less inclined towards certain jobs. Does anyone seriously think it's a problem that non-white females are represented at less than 0.1% of deep sea welders? Humans are not all equal in proclivities or even innate abilities. The proposed solution by diversity campaigners is usually some form of discrimination, usually against white and Asian people. An Asian male has a much, much higher bar to…

The purpose is to give everyone an even chance, not necessarily to make every profession perfectly balanced.

There are enough claims of sexism that I think it's reasonable to conclude there is at least some sexism present. If you eliminated sexism and there was still a sex imbalance, no one would care.

There is a lot of anger arouns this issue, but when you actually talk to people, just about everyone wants the same thing--equality of opportunity.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#26
post #7

Certain demographics are less inclined towards certain jobs. Does anyone seriously think it's a problem that non-white females are represented at less than 0.1% of deep sea welders? Humans are not all equal in proclivities or even innate abilities. The proposed solution by diversity campaigners is usually some form of discrimination, usually against white and Asian people. An Asian male has a much, much higher bar to…

> Certain demographics are less inclined towards certain jobs.

This is true, but it isn't inherent to those demographics. I, as a male, was not inclined to ballet dancer as a child. That's not because men aren't good at it, it's because in my culture, male ballet dancers were gay, and in my culture gay was one of the worst things a man could be. So if women are less inclined towards software jobs, is it because all, or at least most, women don't have what it takes? Or because their culture doesn't encourage girls to study that?

> Humans are not all equal in proclivities or even innate abilities.

This is such an obvious statement that it doesn't need stating and yet you do, so I'm hearing this as you intending to use it as proof that some demographics are not equal in proclivities or innate abilities, in which case see paragraph above.

> The proposed solution by diversity campaigners is usually some form of discrimination.

This may be true. An improperly considered "diversity initiative" can very much be "hire the insert_whatever_here so we have enough of those people around here", which can feel discriminatory to those who may be more qualified but weren't in the correct demographic, and can feel patronizing to those who may be less qualified but got the job because they were of a certain demographic. But just in case you or someone else takes this to mean we should give up on diversity initiatives, we shouldn't. Failure doesn't mean give up, it means iterate.

> An Asian male has a much, much higher bar to cross to go to university, get a tech job, or otherwise than any other group, for example.

... what?

> Equality of opportunity is a given, while equality of outcome is destructive and racist.

When I read this I hear that the equal opportunity is to be interviewed, but equal opportunity starts at birth. Actually before birth. Does Jeff Bezos' children and a child born into the foster care system have equal opportunity? No. You may argue that the child born into the foster care system has good enough opportunity, and that's the American dream, that anyone can rise above their adversities and make something of themselves. In this case it's a mixed bag. Some do, some don't. You can hear success stories from all kinds of people, but to me it's more significant to look at the people who haven't and won't "make something of themselves" and see if there are patterns. Are certain demographics over-represented in this group of people who aren't "making something of themselves"?

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#27
post #21

I don't know, anecdotally, relationships broke down with me and other stakeholders, and I ended up leaving the company, after I pushed hard for an amazing candidate, the first to ever ace my interviews, whereas said other stakeholders wanted a certain diversity candidate, who while I enjoyed meeting didn't do that well. The funny thing is in SF it's the bro-y white guy CEOs who push the wokeness the hardest. Almost f…

Well I can share my individual perspective as a tall white guy. Sure, I've been through extraordinary struggles and life difficulties in my early adulthood, yet life is still pretty much easy mode just from the privilege. If you've ever read The Wheel of Time by Robert Jordan, the best way I can describe it is it almost feels like being ta'veren. Even if I'm having an off-day, not performing well, doing the wrong thi…

There are millions of 'Tall White Guys' in prison, earning minimum wage, living on the streets. It's really not that much of a privilege.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#28
post #27
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I can share my individual perspective as a tall white guy. Sure, I've been through extraordinary struggles and life difficulties in my early adulthood, yet life is still pretty much easy mode just from the privilege. If you've ever read The Wheel of Time by Robert Jordan, the best way I can describe it is it almost feels like being ta'veren. Even if I'm having an off-day, not performing well, doing the wrong thi…

There are millions of 'Tall White Guys' in prison, earning minimum wage, living on the streets. It's really not that much of a privilege.

I was literally homeless and earning minimum wage at one point so this is something I'm familiar with.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#29
post #20
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it does technically fit "racial discrimination." However, some people use that simpler term to talk about historic and current power imbalances. In the United States, there were a lot of extra barriers for non-white people. Some still exist, but there's also the self-perpetuating barriers, like how children from poor households are likely to be poor adults. So, if somebody wants to help solve "racial discriminat…

Where does education fit in in your assumptions ? Even poor people make it up the social ladder thru education. Most of our ancesters were farmers, and most of them very poor too.

You have things like alumni admissions preference at schools that didn't allow black people within just a couple alumni generations.

Re: I'm an interviewer at my company and burnt out

#30

I don't know, anecdotally, relationships broke down with me and other stakeholders, and I ended up leaving the company, after I pushed hard for an amazing candidate, the first to ever ace my interviews, whereas said other stakeholders wanted a certain diversity candidate, who while I enjoyed meeting didn't do that well. The funny thing is in SF it's the bro-y white guy CEOs who push the wokeness the hardest. Almost f…

I would very much like to know the other seven sides to this story.
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