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Repairability

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Re: Repairability

#21

Post by jhickok »

fareesh wrote: post #14

In countries like India we don't really have too many consumer protections. Apple tends to operate similar to a criminal enterprise - they sell defective products / products which become defective after barely any use. I bought the 2015 Macbook Pro which developed the "staingate" issue. In first world countries, I hear that Apple replaced the screens for customers for free (I'm not sure if this is true or whether it'…

Thank you for this perspective-- oftentimes I don't think of how these verticalized monolith companies operate outside of NA/EU.

Re: Repairability

#22

Post by magicalhippo »

margo209320 wrote: post #18
swiftcoder wrote: post #4

Not that it's a justification, per se, but a lot of modern laptops won't boot without a battery. The power adapter often can't provide sufficient power to spin everything up at boot, and needs the battery as a buffer (this is why, if you run your macbook battery completely flat, it needs to charge for a few minutes before it can boot back up).

"The power adapter often can't provide sufficient power to spin everything up at boot, and needs the battery as a buffer" Do you have any proof for that? It sounds very unrealistic to me. These days there aren't even any magnetic disks to spin up at boot time.

Well I literally powered up an oldish laptop two days ago that had been sitting there for a few years, and it turned off three times within a few seconds of booting until I let it sit for a few minutes for the battery to charge.

The power brick is rated at 19V 3.16A output, so 60W, the CPU is a 35W TDP second-gen i3.

Of course a big part of that is spinning up the disk, so as you say I imagine this is quite different these days with SSDs.

Re: Repairability

#23

Post by nerdponx »

peterburkimsher wrote: post #19

I had an A1398 2014 MacBook Pro 15" until a few weeks ago. I also experienced the battery expanding (it was last changed in 2018 just as the AppleCare warranty expired). The replacement battery killed the GPU. The screen turned blank when waking from sleep. It survived another week, but after that, would crash whenever switching to NVIDIA graphics. I can't just replace the battery now - I need to change the logic boa…

Doesn't Apple warranty their repairs even when the machine itself is out of warranty?

Re: Repairability

#24

Post by syshum »

dartharva wrote: post #3

The more I read about Apple products the more they seem to be apt as luxury goods rather than functional computing devices.

Apple is more akin to a Fashion Line than an Electronics company

They have a premium price not because they are a premium product but because "influencers", celebrities, and the wealthy use them, thus they "must be premium" and must have a high $$$

It is perception vs reality, it is marketing vs substance

In this Apple is Genius at perception and marketing

Re: Repairability

#25

Post by syshum »

peterburkimsher wrote: post #19

I had an A1398 2014 MacBook Pro 15" until a few weeks ago. I also experienced the battery expanding (it was last changed in 2018 just as the AppleCare warranty expired). The replacement battery killed the GPU. The screen turned blank when waking from sleep. It survived another week, but after that, would crash whenever switching to NVIDIA graphics. I can't just replace the battery now - I need to change the logic boa…

>>In the end, I'm probably just going to have to learn how to use OpenBoardView, buy a better soldering iron and microscope, and

Or you know go for a better ecosystem that does not have all of these lockin issues

Re: Repairability

#26

Post by lmilcin »

In the meantime my 7yo T440s is as good as new.

I have flooded it twice, once a month after buying it with hot latte. Then second time two years ago when it was dropped into clean water. In the second case the water got absolutely everywhere including between individual leaves of the LCD panel.

Thanks to how it is built, both times I was able to disassemble it myself and clean it properly to remove any water and residues.

I have also changed internal battery which was as simple as unscrewing it and disconnecting from main board. I hacked BIOS to accept 4G M.2 card because when the laptop was certified 4G wasn't even a thing yet.

I will be giving it away and replacing it with a newer one but only because of some outdated technology. It still runs fast, doesn't get hot, panel is perfectly readable and everything works smoothly.

Re: Repairability

#27

Post by swiftcoder »

Causality1 wrote: post #8
swiftcoder wrote: post #4

Not that it's a justification, per se, but a lot of modern laptops won't boot without a battery. The power adapter often can't provide sufficient power to spin everything up at boot, and needs the battery as a buffer (this is why, if you run your macbook battery completely flat, it needs to charge for a few minutes before it can boot back up).

Why are laptops being sold with insufficient power adapters then? That also sounds just flat wrong. Most non-gaming laptops have power supplies with significantly higher outputs than their maximum power draw, and the boot-up surge is incredibly tiny. I would be flatly amazed if a MacBook boot up power draw was even 10% higher than system power draw under maximum load.

MacBooks in particular use USB-C for power these days, which is currently capped at delivering 100 watts. By comparison, many gaming laptops over in the Windows side of the world ship with 180-230 watt power adaptors (using proprietary connectors).

Re: Repairability

#28

Post by swiftcoder »

tveyben wrote: post #10
Causality1 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are laptops being sold with insufficient power adapters then? That also sounds just flat wrong. Most non-gaming laptops have power supplies with significantly higher outputs than their maximum power draw, and the boot-up surge is incredibly tiny. I would be flatly amazed if a MacBook boot up power draw was even 10% higher than system power draw under maximum load.

It’s cheaper - more profit for the OEM. And booting without battery is likely considered a corner case, thus $$$

Considering that the battery in a MacBook is non-removable, it's not just a corner case - it's a warranty-voiding act that the designers explicitly don't have to account for.

Re: Repairability

#29

Post by swiftcoder »

bserge wrote: post #16
thrips552727 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds like a load of bollocks. A laptop, really?. Wish someone on HN can enlighten me.

There's nothing pulling so much power at startup that both the adapter and battery are required. Even older MacBooks would boot with the battery disconnected (in some sort of safe mode). https://osxdaily.com/2019/06/14/how-boot-macbook-pro-without... Newer ones likely wait to check the battery properly. I've not come across any laptop or Android smartphone that wouldn't power up without a battery. However, I do not h…

> I've not come across any laptop or Android smartphone that wouldn't power up without a battery.

I had the pleasure of working on an Android smartphone that wouldn't power up without a battery. Or even with a battery, if the outside temperatures were sufficiently low to cause the battery voltage to drop below the FCC-defined limits for running the radios.

Re: Repairability

#30

Post by sokoloff »

nbzso wrote: post #17

I have an iPad pro wifi from 2018 with totally dysfunctional wifi and speaker and IPS bleeding. This is my second one, the first one I exchanged for screen bleeding also. I have the last usable Mac Book Pro (2013) custom order with i7/750ssd/16gb ram and will change the battery myself soon (Apple refuses to fix laptops from 2013). The last Apple product that I have bought is Mac Mini 2018 - unlike other Apple product…

I held my 2013 MBP for a long time because of the keyboard issue and finally replaced it with the late 2019 MBP. I find the new keyboard fine (though this year it’s spent its time in clamshell mode mostly).
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