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I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

josiahzayner.com

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Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#21

Post by lrossi »

gwilikers wrote: post #12

> I know it sounds a bit dramatic but there really is a class war going on. [...] Your life, your child’s life, your mother, your loved one depends on how much money you make. The government and Pharma companies aren’t going to help you when you can’t afford it either. > If one were to replicate the experiment from scratch, the total individual cost would end up being around $3500, the major costs being $1600 for DNA…

It’s expensive only due to lack of scale.

Also, the advantage of having it available 6-12 months ahead of the official one may be worth the cost to those at risk.

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#22

Post by [deleted] »

djsumdog wrote: post #3

> All three of us developed SARS-CoV2 spike protein neutralizing antibodies. I still can't fucking believe it. Not only did we create and test a successful vaccine, we showed that we could get a gene therapy to work (a DNA vaccine changes the DNA in your cells and so is a gene therapy also) Seems incredibly dangerous. What if 3 years from now, he realizes the changes he made are crashing his immune system? There is n…

[deleted]

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#23

Post by madrox »

vedtopkar wrote: post #9

This sentiment is not unique to biomedicine. It's pretty often you see people finger elitism or capitalism for screwing people over because "I can make it myself." Ethically, you are more than welcome to experiment on yourself. That's your prerogative. But, as has already been expressed here, the issue is once you start giving your creation to others. Even when the science is conceptually very simple, like in the cas…

That is more or less my understanding. This person clearly feels comfortable with his own work. His choice. I would never inject his homebrew, and I would not trust my own understanding enough to do this myself. I don’t think that makes me naive. From what I’ve read, it took no time at all to create the coronavirus vaccine. The time taken was mostly around studying efficacy in various groups and checking side effects.

What I think this highlights is the perceived role and efficacy of regulation in society. Social media, for example, is going through a regulatory discussion, and given its growing role in matters of consequence I don’t think it beyond the pale to consider regulating it. We made that decision about medicine long ago, and I’d assert we are better for it.

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#24

Post by gus_massa »

djsumdog wrote: post #3

> All three of us developed SARS-CoV2 spike protein neutralizing antibodies. I still can't fucking believe it. Not only did we create and test a successful vaccine, we showed that we could get a gene therapy to work (a DNA vaccine changes the DNA in your cells and so is a gene therapy also) Seems incredibly dangerous. What if 3 years from now, he realizes the changes he made are crashing his immune system? There is n…

It changes the DNA in a few cells, that produce the spikes. These cells are killed by the white cells, and after a few steps you hopefully get immunity. The objective is no permanent change of your DNA.

(Actually from time to time a virus fail and it get copy to the DNA of the cells that produce sperms or eggs and it get copied in the next generations. We have a few of these virus, but it is not the usual outcome.)

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#25

Post by notjtrig »

An interesting bit...

"I know it sounds a bit dramatic but there really is a class war going on. There is a group of people who are actively making choices that cause a disproportionate amount of deaths among those in lower social classes."

Thoughts?

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#26

Post by dvfjsdhgfv »

jmercouris wrote: post #5

Here is where I immediately have a red flag from the author: "sometimes I hide the fact that I have PhD because I don't want it to be a symbol of authority or intelligence for myself" yet, at the top of the site "Josiah Zayner, PhD"." well, which one is it Josiah?

If I say "sometimes I feel people are losing the ability to precisely comprehend what they read" it does not necessarily mean I feel this way right now, although I might.

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#27

Post by dvfjsdhgfv »

akiselev wrote: post #8
abdullahkhalids wrote: post #4

Can any biologist confirm there is some actual science going on there? (otherwise, we should flag this). The live-stream is no longer available. The main documentary output seems to be here https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1SracILuRbiZt4f7EVH2J...

Yes, the sequences are available [1] and well within the capabilities of a hobbyist with a little gumption - all they're using is commercial off the shelf services available to any researcher or student. Whether its good science or not is beyond my understanding of this particular subject. It's definitely not usable for any sort of premarketing approval. [1] https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Q18Sh-67NigwabhxBQAtLfR…

> Whether its good science or not is beyond my understanding of this particular subject.

Same here, so I came here to check the comment section looking for someone better informed. Unfortunately the post has been flagged already, so we're unlikely to ever know.

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#28

Post by dschuessler »

vedtopkar wrote: post #9

This sentiment is not unique to biomedicine. It's pretty often you see people finger elitism or capitalism for screwing people over because "I can make it myself." Ethically, you are more than welcome to experiment on yourself. That's your prerogative. But, as has already been expressed here, the issue is once you start giving your creation to others. Even when the science is conceptually very simple, like in the cas…

Your pointing to that component of science that is commonly underappreciated in the public reception: mutual review. Be it in the form of replication, criticism or peer review.

Science is a social activity. So cooking things up in a kitchen all by yourself is consequently not.

The proper way to go forward would be to seek out the accepted forums and channels of his peers to get opinions on his work. That is as much a part of science as is experimenting.

Unrelated: Do I understand it correctly that his sample size is n=3? https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17c7LtrUlnzadif63pR8G...

Re: I Made a Covid-19 Vaccine in My Kitchen and It Worked – Science Still Sucks

#30

Post by WheelsAtLarge »

djsumdog wrote: post #6
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #2

The limiting factor in drug development is not creating the drug, but in testing it. I'd like to see a biohacking approach to drug testing.

When Jenner created (really discovered) the original SmallPox vaccine, he basically just inoculated people with Cowpox and Horsepox. That was over 180 years ago. There were no phases, clinical trials or testing standards back then. Real medicine and snake oil were difficult, if not impossible, to distinguish. Before Jenner, there were groups inoculating people with actual Smallpox (typically in the nose, because it w…

The reason there's so much red tape related to drug development is because people were so free with drug testing in the past. There was a time when the FDA did not exist. We had a situation where people could sell anything and call it a cure without testing. Word of mouth was all that was needed to sell a cure whether it work or not. It was up to each buyer to decide if it cured the problem. We had situations where the cure was worst than the illness.

We need testing. It's the only way we can have confidence in our medical system.

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