I think many people don't really accept that there can be evidence on both sides of an issue. Once there's a critical mass of evidence on one side, each subsequent piece of evidence on the other side is kinda suspect and can be defeated by simple majority. It's a wrong way to think, but I'm sure my thinking on many issues is also like that.
No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
21–30 of 105 posts
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#22>My assertion, paradoxically, is that polarization has greatly diminished the quantity of information being produced and consumed via today's press despite the sea of content they produce. Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media. Noam Chomsky I agree with Chomsky here. >In today's polarized media, each side of the media discourse has established its perspective, and the content they p…
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#23Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#24I don't understand why news sites do not add references and footnotes to their articles. I have been working on an idea for a site that makes "mind maps" of a graph of facts inside of news articles to show how conclusions are reached. However, I think the average person's critical reasoning skills would not appreciate this and just believe what they want to hear.
I think trying to come up with semantic mind maps in articles is likely to limit your audience as it's an abstract critical process that's subject to accusations of, er, subjectivity. On the other hand, a service that reliably led people to improperly cited source material would have value; examples like criminal indictments as described above, or local coverage of events that is then taken up and rewritten (often without attribution or backlinks) by larger outlets.
This could solve local news outlets' revenue problem too. I hate following up a story that goes to a small newspaper in Nowheresville which then asks for a subscription; I'm unlikely to consult that paper for anything else in the foreseeable future. but it's not fair to the Nowheresville Times if Big City News rewrites their content without attribution. If BCN articles about events in Nowheresville were flagged as mere rewrites of NT content, the latter publisher would be able to make a strong argument for pass-through revenue to flow their way.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#25I don't understand why news sites do not add references and footnotes to their articles. I have been working on an idea for a site that makes "mind maps" of a graph of facts inside of news articles to show how conclusions are reached. However, I think the average person's critical reasoning skills would not appreciate this and just believe what they want to hear.
While I agree, it would've been much more illuminating, persuasive, engaging and educational to do a deep dive into the substance of the claims and show why they're likely incorrect. This is really the best way to assuage belief in related conspiracy theories too. We would learn both why the allegations are false and learn about how these false beliefs start and spread. Combine academic rigor (without its stifling formality) with the distribution of journalism. Be less verbose and more numerate and logical. Many bloggers do this but it's missing from the majority of mainstream journalistic outlets.
I somehow think the business model will preclude this though. They're providing outrage entertainment for the masses. Not everyone is a balanced individual with 130 IQ seeking detail and illumination.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#26>My assertion, paradoxically, is that polarization has greatly diminished the quantity of information being produced and consumed via today's press despite the sea of content they produce. Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media. Noam Chomsky I agree with Chomsky here. >In today's polarized media, each side of the media discourse has established its perspective, and the content they p…
Thomas Schelling says otherwise. See http://nifty.stanford.edu/2014/mccown-schelling-model-segreg... and consider the idea of voluntarty ideological segregation in a virtual space.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#27There’s a certain amount of information the world creates, and some fraction of that gets written up in the news.
The first would seem to be vastly larger today, just because the human population has grown significantly and the reduction of poverty has brought far more people to a level where they work on “information-producing” endeavors.
What fraction of that will be covered in the news media, in some form or another? The top segment, such as “who is the new prime minister of France” gets covered today as it did in the past. Similar news from smaller places probably gets covered more, because networks of correspondents have increased, communication has become easier, and the wire service model has had huge effects for efficiency. The same is likely true for the “long end” of domestic news.
We should probably look at not just production, but also distribution: how much information is transmitted. While subscriptions have dropped off a cliff, distribution has vastly increased. I’m in Europe, but regularly read the NYT and dozens of other US outlets. That just wasn’t possible even in the recent past.
They are defining information as “surprise”, but mixing the technological meaning with its common meaning at will. Am I surprised by the name of the next US Secretary of State? Sure, in the way that I had never heard the name before. I’d be more surprised by Whoopi Goldberg, but that doesn’t make the latter more “information-dense”. Newspapers today include all the scores of twelve different sports leagues from all over the world, which alone would likely dominate any actual measure of information. Then again, they dropped their listings of stock prices, which probably reduced that measure by 9x%. To recover, they should print some random number generators output, which is nothing but information according to the theory the article is (ab)using. Which just shows that “information” is ill-defined and probably useless to measure news quality.
This blog post is really just the old complaint about a “liberal bias”, cargo-culting with sciency phrases. No surprise there.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#28My Grandfather, who was an attorney, shared with me that attorneys cut apart narratives with evidence to get to the truth. If all of the evidence is available, the only surviving narrative is most likely the truest representation of an event.
At the time, I didn't appreciate what he meant by that, these days however it seems "obvious" to me. When you are reading a story that says something is now "twice as likely" but doesn't tell you how likely it was before and how likely it is now, that is a missing piece of information that would help you evaluate the overall presentation. That it is missing, may be an indication that the presentation is less compelling if it were present. And it is that which changes something from "information" to a "narrative" in my opinion.
One used to be able to read multiple sources, which is touted these days as "meta journalism", in order to pull the evidence from a number of different narratives in order to arrive at something closer to the truth, but with the consolidation of media that becomes harder to do.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#29For one, frequency bias is real, and people aren't able to dig deep into every single issue they read about online. There's just too much of it. They read snippets and headlines, and cobble together responses from peers or sources they trust to build up their view. As time goes on, one might look into a given topic more and become more well informed. Ideology forms around the responses and ideology informs the responses. Just look at how the disinformation campaigns in 2016 went. The absolute volume of headlines and memes meant that you couldn't refute them one by one. But if you consumed all of them at face value, they created a coherent narrative in many peoples' heads.
And the other point that others have brought up in this thread is bad faith discussions. There's really no point engaging with these other than to rudely and flippantly shut them down. If they get you to respond seriously, you've already lost. They're not playing the same game as you.
Combining these points, I'm not as convinced nowadays that variation in viewpoints in what is needed. Transparency and accurate reporting, certainly, but not a wide variety of takes through some worldview or lens. The reporting from the BLM protests this summer is a good example. Video evidence of police brutalizing protesters and news reporters cut through a lot of the noise and made things clear. It's one thing to go back and forth arguing about numbers and policy, and another to view something, see that it is not what you want our society to look like, and work on actions to take starting with that as a basis.
Re: No surprises here – On the absence of information in today’s media
#30I wonder why people seem to be surprised/upset/perturbed at news media polarization. Humans read the news for fun/excitement/engagement/etc. The vast majority don't have to read the news, they choose to. They choose to read the news over engaging in some other activity that might be more fun/etc. Therefore the news competes with all other fun things to do. Opinion and polarization are more fun and exciting and outrage-inducing than dry, unbiased, fact-based reporting - so you see more and more of the former and less and less of the latter.
This is because of how humans are. This isn't because there are mean content producers. The content that wins is a reflection of humanity. Generally we like to consume content that invokes emotion; facts are boring.
As an aside, I watch (with what I wish wasn't a touch of schadenfreude) as people get upset at the decline of the newspaper industry. I guess it turns out that humans don't really care about journalistic ethics - they just want a hit of dopamine. The noble-ness of journalism IS noble and to be lauded, because it prescribes a standard that goes against the grain of the typical media consumer.