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macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

support.native-instruments.com

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Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#21
post #11

Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly. Heck every Mac is always on a different update because they are scared to even update in Mac only cooperate networks like mine. It has always been a pain in my video editing life too.

>Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly.

Because every update usually also moves things forward. E.g. on Big Sur they moved third party kernel extensions to userland ones. That's safer, less crash prone (an extension issue doesn't bring down the whole system), more modular, makes it possible to upgrade an extension without a reboot, and so on.

Check PC forums of pro music users how often they have issues with drivers, incompatibilities, updates, etc.

And that's not with "switching to a major new architecture" issue, or "moving kernel extensions to userland" type fairs, which are major changes and can understandably bring issues with them (but can be totally worth it long term).

It's just incompatibilities between the million different hardware combinations you can find in a PC, Windows issues, etc.

>Heck every Mac is always on a different update because they are scared to even update in Mac only cooperate networks like mine.

Actually it has been reported time and again that Macs are among the fastest percentage wise to move to the latest OS version compared to Windows PCs, with something like 70% having moved over in a couple of months...

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#22
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The device that can be damaged is a DJ controller with haptic feedback. So it has motors in it, and some kind of audio outputs. If the audio levels get turned to maximum or the motors get sent invalid commands, it could cause the device to damage itself. I’d call it a firmware problem if the motors can be commanded to move too fast, but anyway it may be reason for them to warn their customers. The editorialized hacke…

Or, depending on the cause, “Bugs in Native Instruments hardware / drivers can damage their hardware with Big Sur”.

It seems that the rule the crowd likes to go with is “last change broke it!”, which is something I don’t like very much.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#23
which begs the question... Is backward compatibility dead ?

People are rejoicing when developer updates their app "fast" to support new OS, but once upon a time, one wouldn't even expect to have to update anything at all, just because "new OS version". You can easily run Win 95 app on Win 10. I can run a CNC controller built for WinXp, controlling very destructive equipment on Win7 without issue, and I've been using statically linked binaries on Linux for years without problem, so really WTF ? Are Apple fans just that blind ?

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#24
post #21
post #11

Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly. Heck every Mac is always on a different update because they are scared to even update in Mac only cooperate networks like mine. It has always been a pain in my video editing life too.

> Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly. Because every update usually also moves things forward. E.g. on Big Sur they moved third party kernel extensions to userland ones. That's safer, less crash prone (an extension issue doesn't bring down the whole system), more modular, makes it possible to upgrade an extension without a reboot, and so on. Check PC forums…

> Because every update usually also moves things forward.

Just because something move forward doesn't means it moves in the right direction.

> And because they still have the better OS/hardware combo.

Do they ? How many brain-time did Apple waste yesterday by soft-bricking ALL THE DAMN MACS running Canalina ?

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#25
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly. Because every update usually also moves things forward. E.g. on Big Sur they moved third party kernel extensions to userland ones. That's safer, less crash prone (an extension issue doesn't bring down the whole system), more modular, makes it possible to upgrade an extension without a reboot, and so on. Check PC forums…

> Because every update usually also moves things forward. Just because something move forward doesn't means it moves in the right direction. > And because they still have the better OS/hardware combo. Do they ? How many brain-time did Apple waste yesterday by soft-bricking ALL THE DAMN MACS running Canalina ?

>Just because something move forward doesn't means it moves in the right direction.

Sure. In this case though I meant "in the right direction" too. I, for one, welcome third party kernel extensions moving to userland.

>Do they ? How many brain-time did Apple waste yesterday by soft-bricking ALL THE DAMN MACS running Canalina ?

A little. Nothing like the brain-months I've wasted on Windows and Linux troubleshooting, and I've been using Windows for ~30 years, and Linux for ~20 (plus several UNIX varieties of yore, like SunOS, Solaris, and AIX, with the ocassional toying with FreeBSD as well).

I'm annoyed by several things in Apple land as well (e.g. the keyboards on the last 3 years on laptops, the firewall bypass situation in Big Sur, the not-so-useful touch strip, and lots of minor issues), but I'm also annoyed by the "grass is greener" sentiment all the time, or the "sky is falling/Stallman was right" rhetoric...

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#26

macOS updates almost always break a lot of audio apps. You're better off waiting a few point updates and checking with the vendors of the apps you use before upgrading.

I'm still running Mojave. Fuck 'upgrading' to an operating system that kills a ton of 32-bit VST plugins I paid for a decade or so ago that will probably never get updated, while adding no meaningful features of substance for me.

I don't need a dark theme. I don't need to be able to answer calls from my iPhone on my Mac or whatever.

I just need the software I have paid for, that has worked for 7 consecutive software iterations, to continue to work.

I'm in the 'Snow Leopard was peak MacOS / OSX' camp, honestly; having used the OS as a daily driver since 10.3.x...

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it the Kontrol S4 has moving parts (essentially motors) under USB control. Obviously you could design this sensibly so that no legal inputs result in malfunction let alone damage, but that might cost more, so, do it all in software right? And then you're at the mercy of the software and anything (such as the OS kernel) which that software depends on. We do teach Computer Science / Software Engineering…

> many HN regulars are proud that they either didn't pay any attention in class or never attended and are "self-taught". It's because companies want "superstars" (ie: underpaid people with something to prove by spending a whole bunch of unpaid overtime in order to get $50k at the end of 2-3 years when the company is sold) The truth is in the hardware game, you end up cutting corners in order to deliver something some…

[deleted]

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#28

which begs the question... Is backward compatibility dead ? People are rejoicing when developer updates their app "fast" to support new OS, but once upon a time, one wouldn't even expect to have to update anything at all , just because "new OS version". You can easily run Win 95 app on Win 10. I can run a CNC controller built for WinXp, controlling very destructive equipment on Win7 without issue, and I've been using…

It's just buggy, not dead. However there should be a point when backward compatibility should be dropped, if you want to keep maintaining a sane codebase and interface, or force a "better" way of doing things. When Apple deprecated OpenGL and moved to Metal, I hated it but I actually respected a lot, cuz Metal does have a superior design, and by deprecating old technology they're forcing devs to use this better technology for better software (being proprietary is separate issue).

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The device that can be damaged is a DJ controller with haptic feedback. So it has motors in it, and some kind of audio outputs. If the audio levels get turned to maximum or the motors get sent invalid commands, it could cause the device to damage itself. I’d call it a firmware problem if the motors can be commanded to move too fast, but anyway it may be reason for them to warn their customers. The editorialized hacke…

Yeah, that is an issue of the device IMO. It should prevent itself from being run in a destructive manner so long as the bus itself is in spec (ie no overvoltage, reverse polarity, etc). Unless it is clearly labelled as not to be connected to any system that hasn't been specifically evaluated and qualified by them, this shouldn't be the customers fault. Also, I initially misread this as National Instruments and imagi…

> Also, I initially misread this as National Instruments and imagined a DJ programming in LabView, LMAO.

This made my day. This is one of the funniest things I have ever read.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#30

which begs the question... Is backward compatibility dead ? People are rejoicing when developer updates their app "fast" to support new OS, but once upon a time, one wouldn't even expect to have to update anything at all , just because "new OS version". You can easily run Win 95 app on Win 10. I can run a CNC controller built for WinXp, controlling very destructive equipment on Win7 without issue, and I've been using…

It's just buggy, not dead. However there should be a point when backward compatibility should be dropped, if you want to keep maintaining a sane codebase and interface, or force a "better" way of doing things. When Apple deprecated OpenGL and moved to Metal, I hated it but I actually respected a lot, cuz Metal does have a superior design, and by deprecating old technology they're forcing devs to use this better techn…

Looking at the list of hardware that doesn’t work anymore and I’m delighted I didn’t buy any when i was considering it. I would be very pissed right now if the expensive hardware I bought stopped working due to an OS upgrade. Most of my musical equipment is much older than NI as a company even and I never have to worry about it breaking due to software updates.
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