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AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

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Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#21

Post by snazz »

gowld wrote: post #10
snazz wrote: post #5

I support most of the requirements listed in this article, in addition to removing the 30% cut. I do not support third-party app stores on iOS because I believe that the benefits of increased consumer choice in that regard do not outweigh the concerns of allowing larger companies with significant app ecosystems (or governments) to make their own app stores with different, potentially user-hostile or privacy-compromis…

Definitely user-hostile app stores are better than potentially user-hostile?

That seems like a loaded question.

If third-party app stores are allowed, companies like Epic or Facebook might just make their own app stores (or "launchers"), like they can on Windows. Governments could disallow the App Store and instead use a country-specific app store with apps that compromise privacy and include other user-hostile behavior. While it's arguably the government's responsibility to legislate and enforce privacy regulations, Apple seems to be much better at this than I would trust a government to be. Having the single App Store on iOS devices is easier, more intuitive, less susceptible to malware (and it's easier to remove malware that gets through), less susceptible to extreme government intervention, and better at protecting user privacy.

By using an Apple device, you trust Apple. They design the hardware (including the processor and Secure Enclave), write the software, and run iCloud. Trusting other companies to build their own app stores in a privacy-preserving and user-friendly manner—especially when their business model involves selling user data—seems decidedly user-hostile.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#22

Post by seanalltogether »

kartayyar wrote: post #6

90% of this could be summarized as freemium has made software worse. But I don't think I like any solutions which involves giving Apple more power to disintermediate developers from users even more. I consider limiting the kinds of apps that developers can build a free speech issue. I think making an "Editors Choice Lite" label would help. I.e. that apps can sign up for an optional extra level of vetting to indicate…

I'm convinced the app stores would look very different if they supported free trials and version upgrade pricing. Its weird that we've dropped the fundamental distribution features that powered the software and games industry for such a long time.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#23

Post by viseztrance »

snazz wrote: post #13
trashburger wrote: post #3

Solution: don't let your kids use internet-connected devices until they are of the age where they are capable of independent thought. Making App Store stricter won't fix anything.

Are adults truly capable of independent thought either? For a lot of people, Facebook is extremely difficult to avoid, even if they disagree with its privacy practices. Apple is in a unique position to use its regulatory power to force companies like Facebook and mobile game developers to follow reasonable privacy and advertising practices. Maybe this is the job of the government, but it seems like an acceptable prac…

Let's not compare the adults with children, because the author literally gave his ipad to his one year old as per his own words.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#24

Post by p1necone »

Edit: I'll cop - I kinda very quickly skim read the article before posting this, now that I've read it I realize the author was arguing for better policing of in app purchases and the like, rather than content per se. Sorry - I'll leave this up because it feels like a useful addition to a different, but adjacent conversation anyway. Also my point about consistency before strictness still applies.

Technological filtering is not the solution to raising your kids. If you're worried about them seeing harmful content you can't be giving them unsupervised access to a general computing device.

Imagine how crippled the iDevice experience would have to be to stop kids from accessing anything questionable - it's not tenable to fix this problem just via app store reviews. However I can imagine a password protected browser and appstore toggle option being useful - then you could have a bunch of parent vetted games and learning stuff available, without giving the kids access to anything you don't know about while they're not supervised.

Also question whether you're doing more harm than good - I suspect I would not have followed the lucrative software dev career path that I have if my parents had heavily policed my "screen time" and internet access.

And on AppStore Reviews - they can't be made stricter unless they're also made more consistent. The current problem that people complain about isn't so much that they're too strict, it's that the rules are almost a black box and are not applied consistently.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#25

Post by thatsethnz »

> "No free games or games with In-App Purchases"

This is a great rule. As a father of similarly aged kids (10, 9, 4) this is exactly what I would like to have happen at my house. Unfortunately, I have found games like this difficult to surface on the app store. Is there a decent source for games like this?

Also, Apple needs to think of the impact that the prevalence of these kinds of apps has on their revenue - I spend money on steam, epic, ps4 games etc. mostly because this isn't an issue. (Or is very clearly signposted) But I am unwilling to spend money even on iphone games that are really enjoyed because the antipatterns discussed in this post have made it difficult to trust the vendor. The bottom line is, if I could trust them, I would spend more.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#26

Post by candiddevmike »

thatsethnz wrote: post #25

> "No free games or games with In-App Purchases" This is a great rule. As a father of similarly aged kids (10, 9, 4) this is exactly what I would like to have happen at my house. Unfortunately, I have found games like this difficult to surface on the app store. Is there a decent source for games like this? Also, Apple needs to think of the impact that the prevalence of these kinds of apps has on their revenue - I spe…

With the kids having remote learning, the school district has them playing this game called Prodigy. It has a really insidious "premium" model that it is constantly throwing up in front of my kids. New dance moves, costumes, all things kids want. I'm tempted to complain about it, the district shouldn't be using apps that push crap like this.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#27

Post by [deleted] »

p1necone wrote: post #24

Edit: I'll cop - I kinda very quickly skim read the article before posting this, now that I've read it I realize the author was arguing for better policing of in app purchases and the like, rather than content per se. Sorry - I'll leave this up because it feels like a useful addition to a different, but adjacent conversation anyway. Also my point about consistency before strictness still applies. Technological filter…

[deleted]

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#28

Post by Tainnor »

trashburger wrote: post #3

Solution: don't let your kids use internet-connected devices until they are of the age where they are capable of independent thought. Making App Store stricter won't fix anything.

The whole article hinges on this "we need to protect our children!" argument, but I'm baffled that anyone would think it's a good idea to give your one-year old an iPad.

Technology is a tool. It is dangerous precisely because it is powerful. Don't give technology to people who are not responsible enough to understand this, instead of trying to restrict its power for those people who can actually deal with it. I hate how the big tech companies continue to infantilise their users.

Incidentally, is it just me, or does it seem that Americans are obsessed with trying to protect their children from all possible harm?

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#29

Post by dave84 »

thatsethnz wrote: post #25

> "No free games or games with In-App Purchases" This is a great rule. As a father of similarly aged kids (10, 9, 4) this is exactly what I would like to have happen at my house. Unfortunately, I have found games like this difficult to surface on the app store. Is there a decent source for games like this? Also, Apple needs to think of the impact that the prevalence of these kinds of apps has on their revenue - I spe…

Apple Arcade should have a good range of games for your kids. No IAPs, no up-selling. It's worth the money for my family.

Re: AppStore Reviews Should Be Stricter

#30

Post by ksk »

threeseed wrote: post #19
ksk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, you can have multiple app stores and kid-friendly app stores will specially curate apps to make sure there is no adult content, or other unwanted features. We already do this with a wide variety of physical goods. Apple doesn't get the source code for the App anyway, so a third party can perform the same type of automated + manual review that Apple does. Its time to open up the app store to competition. As a cons…

Epic for example is only going to allow Fortnite to be on their store. So how you are going to convince kids to use only specific app stores? And then if Apple is forced to regulate what is and isn't "kid-friendly" then isn't that just opening them up to the same criticism they have right now.

There are several ways to approach the curation/kid-friendly problem. You can have simple curation apps (which are banned in the current appstore AFAIK) that are not full stores but simply point to an app store (apple or non-apple). You can have websites that link to apps that have been vetted. On the iOS side, there could be a specific kid-mode that prevents certain APIs to be used. I'm thinking no video, audio, location/tracking services, no ads (unless the ad-network takes responsibility), etc.

Apple won't brand any particular app-store as kid-friendly, or otherwise endorse them.

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