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Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

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Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#21
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Makes you wonder that even if you choose not to share with police This is a false choice, because police don't need your permission to obtain video evidence on Amazon's servers if they have a warrant or court order. They don't even have to notify you if they look at it or use it as evidence, either. Most of the time law enforcement just asks providers nicely for the data they want access to, and providers comply. N…

Yep. In the US you generally have no standing to resist a warrant for your data that you handed over to a third party. Don't use cloud based cameras. Products like ring could easily be designed so that your data would be protected-- e.g. encrypt on the device, all storage is encrypted.. you give a password to any client to view it that amazon never sees. Yet even though its straightforward to do so this is not availa…

> mostly for marketing purposes, the fact that they can be abused by authorities for dragnet surveillance without (adequate) due process is just a "bonus".

It's not just a bonus, it's a selling point. Not for normal consumers, but for law enforcement, and Amazon would like to keep the police surveillance use case secret[1].

From The Secret Scripts Amazon Gives to Cops to Promote Ring Surveillance Cameras[2]:

> Documents obtained by Motherboard reveal that Ring provides 46 standardized comments that cops can post on social media, and several documents with scripted responses to possible questions from the public.

[1] https://www.cnet.com/news/amazon-ring-wants-police-to-keep-t...

[2] https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/wjwea4/revealed-the-secre...

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#22
LoRa is super interesting and this is an absolutely logical step for Amazon and for Google Home. Providing ubiquitous gateways for IoT devices could enable an entirely new markets. Not everyone wants to spend $150 for a LoRaWAN gateway, nor do they see the value in doing so. Devices that come pre-configured with LoRa and can connect to a network through an Echo / Nest / Home device will function right out of the box. The marginal cost of adding something like LoRa or BLE to existing Internet connections is essentially zero.

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#25
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Makes you wonder that even if you choose not to share with police This is a false choice, because police don't need your permission to obtain video evidence on Amazon's servers if they have a warrant or court order. They don't even have to notify you if they look at it or use it as evidence, either. Most of the time law enforcement just asks providers nicely for the data they want access to, and providers comply. N…

Yep. In the US you generally have no standing to resist a warrant for your data that you handed over to a third party. Don't use cloud based cameras. Products like ring could easily be designed so that your data would be protected-- e.g. encrypt on the device, all storage is encrypted.. you give a password to any client to view it that amazon never sees. Yet even though its straightforward to do so this is not availa…

There is a big advantage of cloud based cameras and that is that the data is off premises and can't be just taken away on an SD card. Of course you could send video to your own server but that is beyond the capabilities of most users.

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#26
post #3

Are there legal implications on an ISP subscriber if illegal activity is conducted via their network? I would very much mind sharing a ‘small fraction of bandwidth’ while having arbitrarily large legal exposure.

Even if legally you're in the clear, you'd still run the risk of getting all you electronics confiscated until the police figure out that you were just sharing your bandwidth, no?

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#27
post #22

LoRa is super interesting and this is an absolutely logical step for Amazon and for Google Home. Providing ubiquitous gateways for IoT devices could enable an entirely new markets. Not everyone wants to spend $150 for a LoRaWAN gateway, nor do they see the value in doing so. Devices that come pre-configured with LoRa and can connect to a network through an Echo / Nest / Home device will function right out of the box.…

> could enable an entirely new markets.

You mean entirely new ways to get our data?

Why do you think Google home devices are sold at a loss?

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#28
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Makes you wonder that even if you choose not to share with police This is a false choice, because police don't need your permission to obtain video evidence on Amazon's servers if they have a warrant or court order. They don't even have to notify you if they look at it or use it as evidence, either. Most of the time law enforcement just asks providers nicely for the data they want access to, and providers comply. N…

Yep. In the US you generally have no standing to resist a warrant for your data that you handed over to a third party. Don't use cloud based cameras. Products like ring could easily be designed so that your data would be protected-- e.g. encrypt on the device, all storage is encrypted.. you give a password to any client to view it that amazon never sees. Yet even though its straightforward to do so this is not availa…

Amazon can protect you too. They don't care who they are protecting as long as they get paid, see:

https://nypost.com/2020/09/24/amazons-new-dashcam-gadget-all...

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#29
post #3

Are there legal implications on an ISP subscriber if illegal activity is conducted via their network? I would very much mind sharing a ‘small fraction of bandwidth’ while having arbitrarily large legal exposure.

Piratebox [1] over lora? Is this the future of piracy?

[1] https://piratebox.cc/

Re: Amazon details its low-bandwidth Sidewalk neighborhood network

#30

Low bandwidth mesh networking is super interesting but I would prefer not to have it supplied by Buy'n'Large.

Who else has an install base like Amazon in their Alexas and Rings? No TinyCorp could just decide to roll out a service like this. One of the few upsides of having giant companies is seeing the work of their equally big R&D departments
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