Also - Just as a side note - Please share this post. I would like to get as wide a set of opinions as possible so I can assess the general consensus of opinion cross-industry in a few days. Thanks, J
An open letter to the world - the war on education
21–30 of 31 posts
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#22Insight: University fees for Students in the UK have risen from £3500 per year to either £6000 or a maximum of £9000 while the government has cut funding for teaching and research. Most universities have opted to charge the maximum £9000 per year to the surprise of the policymakers. These changes will arrive in 2012. The government also behind start up culture with startup Britain: http://www.startupbritain.org/ But…
Deferred entry to University may be a good option. A (little known) benefit of deferred university education in the UK is that as an 'independent student' (or mature student) you may qualify for full payment of your student fees:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/EducationAndLearning/UniversityA...
I enrolled as an 'independent student' a few years ago (Male, 25 at the time, British citizen, no dependents, no significant savings) and, with part time jobs and moving back to live with my parents, graduated with very little student debt after 3 years.
It's worth considering, of course, that the pace of cuts in the UK may change this between now and when you're 25 (or already has). Just that you know it is an option.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
Okay, seriously, how is this advice not a gigantic blatant lie? Read science fiction written by knowledgeable people who put their knowledge in the story, go to science fiction conventions, attend random lectures in your city, read history books you're actually interested in, read basic textbooks in a variety of fields, go to kink events and learn about anything that interests you, visit a foreign country and stay th…
First, the author is 16 years old. It matters. Yes, college is, all things being equal, a great venue to encounter a lot of opportunities to expand one's base of knowledge and depth of character. Second, he lives in the UK. College won't run him American prices. Third, I truly think it's irresponsible to advise to the general populace that they skip college. Going to college need not be a headlong dive into staggerin…
Suppose you can rent a room for £250 per mo, eat and dress and buy utilities for the same and spend say £50 per mo of course on uni materials (books, tech, disposables). That's about £6450 pa. Add on fees of £7500.
Three year course under this regimen is c. £40k or $65k.
At my college (ie Uni) I paid 320 per mo for a room (quite a few years ago). Fees could be £9000 pa. At that rate the figures work out to c. $80k USD for a 3 year course.
I don't think that the $80k is the worst case scenario.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
Okay, seriously, how is this advice not a gigantic blatant lie? Read science fiction written by knowledgeable people who put their knowledge in the story, go to science fiction conventions, attend random lectures in your city, read history books you're actually interested in, read basic textbooks in a variety of fields, go to kink events and learn about anything that interests you, visit a foreign country and stay th…
Matt, its not so much the price Im worried about, If I had to, I would make that much to fund my education, the thing I worry about is he value college brings. Would I be 'wasting' 2 years for all intents and purposes when I could be applying my time elsewhere?
The tax-payer pay you to do those two years don't they?
Personally I'd stick at school to do A-levels unless you were going in to something which is guaranteeing to make you a living and progress your career.
Uni, different question.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#25Insight: University fees for Students in the UK have risen from £3500 per year to either £6000 or a maximum of £9000 while the government has cut funding for teaching and research. Most universities have opted to charge the maximum £9000 per year to the surprise of the policymakers. These changes will arrive in 2012. The government also behind start up culture with startup Britain: http://www.startupbritain.org/ But…
Fellow UK resident here. The political reasoning behind the hike in fees is to make young people think harder about whether a university degree is actually going to be useful to them in their career. It's fairly clear that vocational courses would benefit some people a lot more than theoretical/academic courses, and society would benefit from this too. At the moment young people tend to go to university by default, a…
This is certainly a way to see it. Its rational and logic. And of course, I don't think the public shouldn't pay shitty schools were people only party.
However, I wonder what the results in reality, where people are usually not acting so rational, will be. If people were that rational in first place, wouldn't they see, that the amount of money they won't earn while they are in college instead of working is way larger than the fees?
I don't know the society in the UK very well, but here in Germany I had friends in third grade, who where sent to school that won't lead to degrees that qualify for university! They we're smart and had good grades, but their parents wanted them to earn money once they're 16.
I wonder how many parents would have taken them out of school even before the ago of 16 if only it was legal. And that whole system of compulsory education is >100 years old, here! Isn't it a fact, that todays world requires more learning and therefore more time in school? Delayed maturity is a trend as long as homo sapiens sapiens exists.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#26College or University education is more than the "education". It's a way of life that people go through to gain some incredible social experiences that you can't get elsewhere. Now I agree that we always need to improve our education, but for the "college is worthless" because it doesn't help your career type, a great college(not a vocational school) is never for your career, it's for personal growth.
On a different note, do people notice that there are more and more teenagers using HN? I feel like HN is the new Myspace again.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#27I wonder why his choice is limited to 1) seeking to have a lucrative career at a big company, and 2) apparently seeking to hit a home run with a start up.
A third choice would be to immigrate to a country which still has cheap land and, as a single man, perform whatever is work necessary, for a few years, to buy and own a homestead outright. This could be done in about five years if he was frugal enough. Then... just do whatever the heck he feels like: get an education, start a business, save the world, whatever.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#28Josh - if you are a UK resident and citizen, you should be able to go to college and uni for free or for very nominal fees correct? Why the $80K debt?
Here is one perspective: 9 out of 10 startups fail. So even if you do drop out and start your own company, you are not likely to succeed the first or even second and third time round. But you will LEARN A LOT! You will learn a lot of things that uni would not teach you. That said, you can learn this whenever you start your company - at age 16 or age 22, or 33 in my case. That opportunity will not just go away because you go to college.
On the flip side, if you do go to college (a must IMO) and further 3 years of university you will also learn a lot. You will learn how to think about ideas and build your own perspective on the world around you so you dont have to listen to people like Peter Thiel (who btw not only went to university but also to law school afterwards. in fact vast majority of the "thielians" as you call them have multiple higher ed degrees.) This oppty will go away. People do go to college at a later age, but believe me its a lot harder, less interesting and extremely infrequent.
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#29Insight: University fees for Students in the UK have risen from £3500 per year to either £6000 or a maximum of £9000 while the government has cut funding for teaching and research. Most universities have opted to charge the maximum £9000 per year to the surprise of the policymakers. These changes will arrive in 2012. The government also behind start up culture with startup Britain: http://www.startupbritain.org/ But…
Fellow UK resident here. The political reasoning behind the hike in fees is to make young people think harder about whether a university degree is actually going to be useful to them in their career. It's fairly clear that vocational courses would benefit some people a lot more than theoretical/academic courses, and society would benefit from this too. At the moment young people tend to go to university by default, a…
I agree with you, Im at university atm in newcastle. If you can get into a good university, take it. There should be some grants to limit some of debt. Of course you could also apply to a Scottish university like Edinburgh which I think is only £1000 a year
Re: An open letter to the world - the war on education
#30College or University education is more than the "education". It's a way of life that people go through to gain some incredible social experiences that you can't get elsewhere. Now I agree that we always need to improve our education, but for the "college is worthless" because it doesn't help your career type, a great college(not a vocational school) is never for your career, it's for personal growth. On a different…
There are plenty of experiences in the world that don't help your career, but rather help you grow personally. College may be one of them. On the other hand, doing things that help your career doesn't mean in any way that you don't grow personally. And so, the question becomes if you are a person who can deal with getting this personal growth without any other motivation or not. If growing personally is just not enough, then college may not be the best option and you may want to seek something else.
Personally, I prefer working on things that satisfy both conditions: 1) make me grow personally 2) help me achieve my business goals. I tried going with only one of those things (just 1 or just 2) and I could never managed to accomplish anything significant this way.
However, I've seen a lot of happy people who were able to do a lot with just one of those conditions.