Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000) • Hacker News Board

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#21

Post by INTPenis » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:06 PM UTC

A swedish rapper said in 1998; "Den enda sanna demokraten är anarkist", translates to "the only true democrat is anarchist".

Not meaning the Democratic party in the US but rather a literal interpretation of the two words. Democrat meaning rule of the people and anarchist meaning no leaders.

I was raised to believe in anarchism, and I still do at heart. But if it were ever to work we'd need strict and global regulations on centralized power that would need to be upheld by a coalition which would itself become a centralized power.

Because evolution itself is randomness unchecked. So a political ideology alone can't control when someone will come along wanting to exploit systems to break free and gain more power for themselves or their own people.

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#22

Post by Nursie » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:06 PM UTC

oxymoran wrote: post #11

“Anarchists are simply people who believe human beings are capable of behaving in a reasonable fashion without having to be forced to.” My anarchist sympathies want this to be true but this is a demonstrably false fairy tale. Just look at how we treat the planet and other living things in the presence of lawful order. Why would you assume that we would act righteously in the absence of law? It is painfully obvious th…

Exactly this. It's a lovely dream, but humans are lazy, aquisitive, and many would sell their own grandmother to gain a perceived advantage.

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#23

Post by pessimizer » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:07 PM UTC

feralimal wrote: post #2

Yes, apparently he died last week. The person said to be behind the phrase we are the 99% at the Occupy Wall Street movement. He was an interesting character. My question would be: do anarchists really work as professors at the London School of Economics? And Yale? Aren't you a 'system man' at that point?

It's a good question. Not specifically about the London School of Economics, because that was started by Marxist Fabian Society members 125 years ago, but about a lot of academia.

Of course anarchism is a resistance to rule by domination, not to systems and procedures. Some universities are no doubt power centers, though.

edit: anarchism means "no ruler." It's usually painted by people who think rulers are necessary as something like amorphism i.e. "no shape."

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#24

Post by Giorgi » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:07 PM UTC

chewbacha wrote: post #18

The early descriptions reminded me of libertarianism. did anyone else feel that? “Libertarians seek to maximize political freedom and autonomy, emphasizing individualism, freedom of choice and voluntary association.” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism

Yes, libertarianism is quite close to anarchy or minarchy. It looks like such sentiments are very strong in places where goverment has failed their people for dozens of years, in comparison of Europe for example.

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#25

Post by amadeuspagel » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:08 PM UTC

I wonder how a similar essay for other ideologies would look like. Do you buy things? You're a capitalist. Do you keep some things the way they are? You're a conservative. Do you clean your room? You're a fascist. But I doubt someone would bother writing such essays, and if someone did, I doubt it would get upvoted to the HN frontpage. What is it about this that appeals to people? An ideology that feels edgy, but doesn't actually offend anyone?

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#26

Post by Retr0 » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:08 PM UTC

feralimal wrote: post #2

Yes, apparently he died last week. The person said to be behind the phrase we are the 99% at the Occupy Wall Street movement. He was an interesting character. My question would be: do anarchists really work as professors at the London School of Economics? And Yale? Aren't you a 'system man' at that point?

Well he was fired by Yale for his political actions (Although of course they didn't say that). https://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/oct/25/usa.internatio...

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#27

Post by yosito » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:09 PM UTC

People mean different things when they say they're anarchist. This article describes a mix of libertarianism, humanism and egalitarianism that is quite admirable. But many anarchists are willing to use violence against anything or anyone they perceive as powerful or oppressive, and it's pretty easy to frame pretty much anyone you disagree with in those terms. There's a reason that anarchism is associated with violent stereotypes. I personally prefer to identify with values like egalitarianism and humanitarianism without a label like anarchism that is often associated with violence that I disagree with and don't want to be even remotely associated with.

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#28

Post by evgen » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:09 PM UTC

mathieuh wrote: post #12

feralimal wrote: post #2

Yes, apparently he died last week. The person said to be behind the phrase we are the 99% at the Occupy Wall Street movement. He was an interesting character. My question would be: do anarchists really work as professors at the London School of Economics? And Yale? Aren't you a 'system man' at that point?

We all have to live in this system, it's unrealistic to think all anarchists should be ideologically pure and live in the woods off the land like Kaczynski. I believe thinking and writing and getting these ideas into the mainstream can be a form of praxis. As Zizek says, sometimes the most revolutionary thing to do is nothing at all.

Ah, the wonderful 'do as I say, not as I do' flavour of anarchism. Apparently, it is the only type of anarchism one actually finds in the wild.

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#29

Post by bjt2n3904 » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:10 PM UTC

I don't often read anything from anarchists. Whenever I do, it always comes off as sophomoric. Pretentious sophistry.

When you boil down his questions, they're not serious questions about anarchy, they're lame excuses for him to keep talking.

- Do you wait for your turn on a crowded bus?

- Are you a member of a sports team or small group without a leader?

- Do you think politicians suck, and people are selfish?

- Do you really believe the things you were told as a child?

Good grief. These talking points are so generic, any political ideology could use these.

"Are you a communist? The answer may surprise you! Do you like eating toast for breakfast? Many communists also like to eat toast!"

Re: Are you an anarchist? The answer may surprise you (2000)

#30

Post by feralimal » Sat, Sep 05, 2020, 1:10 PM UTC

mathieuh wrote: post #12

feralimal wrote: post #2

Yes, apparently he died last week. The person said to be behind the phrase we are the 99% at the Occupy Wall Street movement. He was an interesting character. My question would be: do anarchists really work as professors at the London School of Economics? And Yale? Aren't you a 'system man' at that point?

We all have to live in this system, it's unrealistic to think all anarchists should be ideologically pure and live in the woods off the land like Kaczynski. I believe thinking and writing and getting these ideas into the mainstream can be a form of praxis. As Zizek says, sometimes the most revolutionary thing to do is nothing at all.

Absolutely. The system is pervasive and we have to live within it.

But should you embrace it? While Yale and LSE are no doubt great institutions, to my mind they are also up there as educators of those who go on to become the system's top managers.