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Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

physicscentral.com

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Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#21

Post by rhaygood »

rdl wrote: post #20

When the SSC was cancelled, I decided I never wanted to be a scientist (I was 15 or so); it would be so horrible to work on a program like this and be entirely dependent upon the government for funding, then have it killed. Entrepreneurship seems much more incremental; if you raise 50% as much money, you can still often do things, just with more risk and pain; if you have a big grant funded science project, 50% in ge…

The death of the SSC kept me out of particle physics. I was thinking of becoming a theoretical particle physicist, but I'm skeptical of doing theory without frequent input from experiments - it may be mathematically elegant, but it may well not be physics. I eventually went into biology, where there's more data of some kinds than we know what to do with, albeit other kinds of data we'd like are still hard to come by.

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#22

Post by tzs »

m0th87 wrote: post #8
tzs wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of game changing things are you thinking of? Colliders help us learn what model is correct (or rather let us eliminate incorrect models) of very low level physics. We don't remotely have any technology to do anything with physics at that low a level, so isn't knowing which model may be correct pretty much going to remain of theoretical and philosophical interest only? It's good to figure that out, but it is…

At some point electromagnetism was a "low level" theory, but now you've taken advantage of all that basic research by typing that comment up in a computer and publishing it for the world to see. The practical application of this sort of stuff is rarely obvious, and sometimes decades out, but it's certainly there.

I disagree that electromagnetism was ever a "low level" theory in the sense that I'm using. What I mean by a high level theory is that it deals with things that we can reasonably manipulate and interact with in an extended fashion.

What I mean by a low level theory is something that deals with the very lowest level building blocks of the universe--things that are locked away inside the "elementary" particles, or that mediate forces like the strong force. We can, with enough energy, coax them out to play--for microseconds, and in small quantity.

I'm not saying we shouldn't be doing research into the low level stuff. I'd just like to see something more concrete than "game changing potential for us as a species" to justify the argument that the SSC would have been a better project to fund than the ISS, given that we couldn't have both.

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#24

Post by arethuza »

jf wrote: post #5

If you found this pictures to be interesting, you might also like some of photo sets of other abandoned facilities: Vandenberg Missile Sites: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215762296233064... A Missile Silo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215760341039595... USA Refinery: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215759418921441... (See also: http://uer.ca )

Subterranea Britannica: http://www.subbrit.org.uk/

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#25

Post by JonnieCache »

arethuza wrote: post #24
jf wrote: post #5

If you found this pictures to be interesting, you might also like some of photo sets of other abandoned facilities: Vandenberg Missile Sites: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215762296233064... A Missile Silo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215760341039595... USA Refinery: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215759418921441... (See also: http://uer.ca )

Subterranea Britannica: http://www.subbrit.org.uk/

Also the UK Urban Exploration Forums: http://28dayslater.co.uk

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#26

Post by perlgeek »

rhaygood wrote: post #21
rdl wrote: post #20

When the SSC was cancelled, I decided I never wanted to be a scientist (I was 15 or so); it would be so horrible to work on a program like this and be entirely dependent upon the government for funding, then have it killed. Entrepreneurship seems much more incremental; if you raise 50% as much money, you can still often do things, just with more risk and pain; if you have a big grant funded science project, 50% in ge…

The death of the SSC kept me out of particle physics. I was thinking of becoming a theoretical particle physicist, but I'm skeptical of doing theory without frequent input from experiments - it may be mathematically elegant, but it may well not be physics. I eventually went into biology, where there's more data of some kinds than we know what to do with, albeit other kinds of data we'd like are still hard to come by.

> but I'm skeptical of doing theory without frequent input from experiments - it may be mathematically elegant, but it may well not be physics.

Sad that you didn't chose the path of science - we need more people with that healthy scepticism.

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#27

Post by perlgeek »

m0th87 wrote: post #8
tzs wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of game changing things are you thinking of? Colliders help us learn what model is correct (or rather let us eliminate incorrect models) of very low level physics. We don't remotely have any technology to do anything with physics at that low a level, so isn't knowing which model may be correct pretty much going to remain of theoretical and philosophical interest only? It's good to figure that out, but it is…

At some point electromagnetism was a "low level" theory, but now you've taken advantage of all that basic research by typing that comment up in a computer and publishing it for the world to see. The practical application of this sort of stuff is rarely obvious, and sometimes decades out, but it's certainly there.

Same for quantum mechanics.

To understand semiconductors properly, you need quantum mechanics - once an obscure theory that Einstein never accepted.

Today's hard discs rely on the Giant Magnetoresistance (GMR), an effect based on the spin polarizations of electrons. Spin is a property that can only be understood with quantum mechanics, there's no proper classic theory (and I guess there never will be) of spin.

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#28

Post by arethuza »

JonnieCache wrote: post #25
arethuza wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Subterranea Britannica: http://www.subbrit.org.uk/

Also the UK Urban Exploration Forums: http://28dayslater.co.uk

Some interesting stuff on that site - I'd love to know why there is an ex Soviet submarine moored in the Medway.

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#29

Post by yankeeracer73 »

jf wrote: post #5

If you found this pictures to be interesting, you might also like some of photo sets of other abandoned facilities: Vandenberg Missile Sites: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215762296233064... A Missile Silo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215760341039595... USA Refinery: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tunnelbug/sets/7215759418921441... (See also: http://uer.ca )

This missile silo "home" popped up on Reddit a few years ago. not sure if it was ever sold, but certainly a unique approach of what to do with old facilities: http://www.silohome.com/

Re: Urban Decay: Exploring an old abandoned particle collider facility

#30

Post by JonnieCache »

CoachRufus87 wrote: post #15

If I had the capital, I'd build a vast data center there. It seems like a great location in the middle of the US.

Haven't we all read Cryptonomicon and dreamed of having sovereignty over our very own impenetrable data-bunker?
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