Do I need to go to university? • Hacker News Board

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#21

Post by cameronbrown » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:56 AM UTC

I'm taking the degree apprenticeship route (19 yo). From a purely educational point of view, there wasn't much University could teach me that I wasn't prepared to learn on my own, so making money and shipping real stuff is far more valuable for me. Of course, this highly depends on the individual.

There is also downsides, like the fact it is a job at the end of the day, and that comes with politics as well as technical challenges.

I'd again make the decision (over University) in a heartbeat.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#22

Post by oleks » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:56 AM UTC

mvind wrote: post #14

I think the freedom to pursue intellectual curiosity is a thing which universities offer almost unconditional unlike jobs. This is a perk that not a lot of jobs in the real world offers. Almost nowhere else in a person's life are you given such an opportunity to invest in ones interests. But I'm biased towards going to uni, since I live in Denmark where I get paid monthly for going to university.

You are not paid to go the university in Denmark. You are awarded credits by the government, and it is up to you to do something sensible with those credits. Don't waste them on needless courses! Learn that which will yield you (and the Danish government) the greatest benefits throughout the rest of your life.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#23

Post by barry-cotter » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:57 AM UTC

orian wrote: post #16

HenryBemis wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) Yes, you do. 2) No, you don't. 3) Depends. 2&3: I knew a guy, his father had sheep, plenty of them. He never bothered with Uni. He has been studying/training on seminars regarding agriculture, animal care, etc. He is set for life. He will never sit on a university theatre and keep notes. He does use technology (I remember how he was shocked when he discovered YouTube videos that exploded his mind and knowledge). H…

Statistically, people with master earn more and it's easier to get a job (other options are: you get aquihired, have a shit of money; your parents have lot of great connections etc.)

This is conflating the selection and treatment effects. The difference in earnings between people who would be admitted to a Master’s programme if they applied and those who actually apply and graduate is going to be far smaller than the difference between a random Bachelor’s holder and a random Master’s holder.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#24

Post by rvz » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:57 AM UTC

Depends on the profession. Generally if the goal is to be a qualified medical / legal professional, it is required to get a university degree from either medical school / law school respectively. Researcher? Maybe, Maybe not. But I won't be surprised if many research positions will ask for a degree.

Software Developer? Not really. FAANMG SWE Job? I won't risk it if I'm not famous with 10K other people applying.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#25

Post by bshimmin » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:57 AM UTC

There's also a weird flip side to all these downsides. Once you establish yourself as competent there is this kind of threshold effect where not having a university degree can suddenly start causing people to actually take you more seriously. This kind of countersignalling effect seems to be common when you do non-traditional things.

I'm not sure this is a real thing unless you're, say, Richard Branson. I also can't really imagine many circumstances in which you're doing something non-traditional and you can't just pretend you don't have a degree by neglecting to mention it... and if you've already reached a level of "significance" in a non-traditional thing where someone might actually check, well, you've probably already done better than most.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#26

Post by moksly » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:57 AM UTC

I think it depends a lot on where you are in the world. In my country where access to education is paid for by the government, and the state pays you $850 a month to study for 5 years once reach educations beyond “High School”, work places kind of expect you to have a degree. You can’t even really be a sales person at a supermarket if you haven’t spent a few years getting a degree, or are under the age of 18 (less pay). Crafty professions takes you through a mix of bookish education and apprenticeship for 4 years, but they too lead to a degree.

Programming is one of the few fields, that isn’t packing boxes of frozen fish, where a career without a degree is possible here, and even on that field time is running out for people without degrees because so many young people have been getting them for the past decade.

But that is my country, here you’d be absolutely crazy (or perhaps challenged in some way) to not finish an education.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#27

Post by mvind » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:58 AM UTC

clarry wrote: post #19

mvind wrote: post #14

I think the freedom to pursue intellectual curiosity is a thing which universities offer almost unconditional unlike jobs. This is a perk that not a lot of jobs in the real world offers. Almost nowhere else in a person's life are you given such an opportunity to invest in ones interests. But I'm biased towards going to uni, since I live in Denmark where I get paid monthly for going to university.

Yeah it depends on a lot of things. Maybe university isn't where your interests are, but you kinda need a degree and a job? I see lots of students whose life revolves around making it through courses and collecting ECTS points instead of really pursuing their interests..

Oh for sure! You can't ignore the fact that having a degree is great to fall back on.

But as you go closer towards research those people start falling off.

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#28

Post by sdan » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:58 AM UTC

fr2null wrote: post #15

I am 18 year old, I'm already working as a developer, and they have offered me a very nice full time job offer. I have been thinking about whether or not to go to university for most of the past year. In the end, I did choose to go to university. I will be working part-time to pay about 90% of it (including housing) which means I'll have practically no debt. The main reason for me to go, was that I don't want to de a…

Shopfiy intern?

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#29

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 9:59 AM UTC

HenryBemis wrote: post #10

tempodox wrote: post #3

Yes, you do.

1) Yes, you do. 2) No, you don't. 3) Depends. 2&3: I knew a guy, his father had sheep, plenty of them. He never bothered with Uni. He has been studying/training on seminars regarding agriculture, animal care, etc. He is set for life. He will never sit on a university theatre and keep notes. He does use technology (I remember how he was shocked when he discovered YouTube videos that exploded his mind and knowledge). H…

[deleted]

Re: Do I need to go to university?

#30

Post by AdrianB1 » Mon, Jun 01, 2020, 10:00 AM UTC

thereyougo wrote: post #13

Great article. I'm sure that there are plenty of people here who went to university and also run a successful company. If any of you see this comment: If you could change the way the university tech you, what you would do?

I would cut half of it. The best things I learned in college (CS) were economics, finance and statistics, it helped me a lot when I got a job as IT analyst in a sales team in a big company, being able to understand the work, purpose and environment and become a valuable contributor , not that geek that was speaking a different language nobody understood.

What I would add to college curriculum today is a good project management course, up to PMP level; also for CS, an equivalent of ITIL foundation.

For CS the biggest gap I see in fresh graduates are testing and performance and a more solid foundation on RDBMS: even in the era of NO-SQL and HADOOP the starting point is still understanding RDBMS.