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TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

asia.nikkei.com

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Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#21

Post by coliveira »

forgot_again wrote: post #3

Escalation between the US and China is inevitable. China is fundamentally opposed to everything the US and Democracies around the world stand for politically. Likewise, the US and friends are fundamentally opposed to everything China stands for politically. There is no Universe in which two diametrically opposed juggernauts do not come into conflict. Conflict is simply inevitable when the stakes are this high and the…

This is a bunch o ideological BS. China just wants to make money, it doesn't care if the US is running a dictatorship or whatever. It is the US government that is trying to stir up ideological issues because it doesn't see any other way to compete with China. Everything was very fine while China was just supplying Walmart with cheap plastic stuff.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#23

Post by jacquesm »

bsder wrote: post #9
euix wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about tanks or numbers its national resolve and there each side can vastly misread the other. Each side believes it has greater resolve and is in the right. There is no quantitative way to measure this. The only way to to find out is to fight. Just like two people who size each other up, one may be bigger or faster but the will to prevail and willingness to bare any sacrifice and tolerate pain in order to ac…

> It's not about tanks or numbers its national resolve and there each side can vastly misread the other. Agreed, but to be perfectly honest, I would be 100% happy to see the US pull all manufacturing out of China and put it back on US soil. The US has gained a temporary price reduction in labor that is now evaporating, gained no access to the Chinese market or influenced China to open further, and has lost the actual…

And who in the US will do the work? It's not just the jobs that went overseas, it's also the factories, the molds, and the skills, on top of that we all apparently want cheap stuff.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#24

Post by jacquesm »

nitrobeast wrote: post #19
forgot_again wrote: post #3

Escalation between the US and China is inevitable. China is fundamentally opposed to everything the US and Democracies around the world stand for politically. Likewise, the US and friends are fundamentally opposed to everything China stands for politically. There is no Universe in which two diametrically opposed juggernauts do not come into conflict. Conflict is simply inevitable when the stakes are this high and the…

Xi’s China is abosolutely authoritorian, but that’s not what this conflict is about. This is more like US vs Japan in the 80s, where US wants to secure its influence and power, by keeping others down if necessary.

Unlike Japan China has a large (potential) internal market.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#26

Post by Polylactic_acid »

dannyw wrote: post #15
augustt wrote: post #6

Wow. Can someone more familiar with stuff explain how much of a big deal this is? Does this completely kneecap Huawei/China?

In the immediate future, Huawei will be fine: > Huawei has been preparing for such a move by the U.S. since the end of last year, including stockpiling more than a year's worth of networking equipment-related chips, especially for its crucial telecom equipment and carrier business, sources told Nikkei Asian Review.

And in the distant future, all common chips and designs will be made without the US.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#27

Post by dannyw »

jacquesm wrote: post #17

And thus enables the Chinese semiconductor industry.

The Chinese semiconductor industry is going to happen no matter what; it is one of their strategic priorities and they have been moving in this direction for a long time.

This is about making it harder and inflicting some pain on them.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#28

Post by harpratap »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #12
harpratap wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it will be such a dramatic shift. It will be more of a middle ground IMO. The mega corporations of US will be regulated by the government just like it happens in China. And China will end up with more rights and transperancy like a democracy.

China becoming more democratic has been a pipe dream getting sold by businesses making money off the fantasy for 3 decades and running. The opposite is currently happening.

People said the same thing about free markets in Soviet Union. Yet here we are with entrepreneurs and stock markets in Communist China.

Re: TSMC halts new Huawei orders after US tightens restrictions

#30

Post by fermienrico »

To preface, firstly - I am a supporter of free global trade and greater collaboration between countries to maximize the benefit of each other.

The problem starts when there is a massive asymmetry in the trade. China has completely blocked US services from Google to Uber, and gladly accepts manufacturing investment - Tesla Shanghai factory, Intel's Chengdu factory, etc. because the CCP knows that they will gain tremendously by having IP physically based in China. It leaks like a sieve. I've seen it first hand (in semiconductor industry).

America should protect its own interests and interests of other democratic nations before they get eroded, dismantled and sold off to CCP's interests. If China doesn't want American software services running and fairly competing because of CCP surveillance requirements, well...then the US should block all Chinese services from exploiting users[1] and their data, may be EU should block Chinese services from running there until there is strict GDPR requirements and the data is located in EU datacenters. There should be independent datacenter security audits just like CCP wants keys to iCloud datacenters. That would just get us to the fairness level and that's still not enough - there should be a reverse asymmetry to make up for last 20 years of damage - incentivize US/EU services and manfuacturing while simultaneously imposing sanctions and import duties on goods/services made in China. Why not? Can someone tell me why the US/EU shouldn't do the same? I should not be able to buy $1.99 USB cable including shipping from China.

[1] https://citizenlab.ca/2020/05/we-chat-they-watch/

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