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Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

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Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#21
>I received an email today from Skype that someone had changed the email address on an old Skype account of mine. Presumably this means that they were able to gain access to a password. There was no mechanism in the email to block the action

I lost my Twilio account yesterday through the same method - haven't heard back and I've been wondering if I'm not the only one.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#22

> Both emails encouraged me to contact customer support. I did so only to be met with a request to fill out an online form with an incredible amount of personal information to verify the account. Why would I provide 10X the personal info (...)? This by itself looks like a phishing attack. Did you click a link to Skype support in the second email message or find it by yourself going to the Skype website and browsing a…

This was my thought, too, but then I remembered that Blizzard asked me for a photo of a government issued ID card to delete my Battle Net account for some reason, and no, that wasn't a phishing attempt; it's in their documentation: https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/2659

So, maybe it could be legit.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#24

Skype security has been flawed ever since that series of odd buyout events that led to the sudden removal of end-to-end encrypted peer to peer operation. First eBay bought what they thought was Skype but instead was only the license to the branding and users and not the p2p backend tech the swiss guys still owned. Then Microsoft stepped in out of nowhere to take the useless brand from eBay and the actual backend only…

Skype's founders are Danish and Swedish, and the business had offices in London, Luxembourg, Estonia (well that's Blue Moon, where the p2p was developed) and more.

I'm not sure how much diligence Ebay ever did on their purchase of Skype, but it never seemed to me like they had a credible business plan for what to do with it. Something something about integrating with sellers. Felt more like the leadership there suffered from some Bay Area strategic acquisition envy. I remember being on painful calls with Ebay and Skype engineering who had very different ideas of how infrastructure should be deployed.

Anyway, Ebay spun off Skype (at a loss) to private equity ... not to MS. Skype floated around in PE for a few years before the (enormous) MS purchase. MS promptly put Skype in an advertising division of all places. I've heard rumors that the DoJ encouraged MS to make the acquisition ... to get Skype calls in the hands of an entity that would be more favorable to lawful interception requests. MS certainly has a painful history with the DoJ, but I really don't know if it's credible or not.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#25

Skype security has been flawed ever since that series of odd buyout events that led to the sudden removal of end-to-end encrypted peer to peer operation. First eBay bought what they thought was Skype but instead was only the license to the branding and users and not the p2p backend tech the swiss guys still owned. Then Microsoft stepped in out of nowhere to take the useless brand from eBay and the actual backend only…

They gradually removed[0] the peer to peer operation because it sucked - quality was bad, calls dropped, outages, bad mobile support. [0] https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/skype...

Quality was not bad, calls didn't drop, no outages, good mobile support. Because it's p2p couldn't be hacked, it was replaced.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#26

Skype security has been flawed ever since that series of odd buyout events that led to the sudden removal of end-to-end encrypted peer to peer operation. First eBay bought what they thought was Skype but instead was only the license to the branding and users and not the p2p backend tech the swiss guys still owned. Then Microsoft stepped in out of nowhere to take the useless brand from eBay and the actual backend only…

They gradually removed[0] the peer to peer operation because it sucked - quality was bad, calls dropped, outages, bad mobile support. [0] https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/skype...

And it meant that random users' computers were being drafted into running a supernode and relaying traffic for other users, without permission or even any notice. Not only did this consume CPU time and bandwidth on the affected users' computers, but it also put anyone running a supernode in a position to observe and tamper with network traffic between other users.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#27

Skype security has been flawed ever since that series of odd buyout events that led to the sudden removal of end-to-end encrypted peer to peer operation. First eBay bought what they thought was Skype but instead was only the license to the branding and users and not the p2p backend tech the swiss guys still owned. Then Microsoft stepped in out of nowhere to take the useless brand from eBay and the actual backend only…

Curios, What happen to founders ? Is there any product based on original Skype p2p tech ?

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They gradually removed[0] the peer to peer operation because it sucked - quality was bad, calls dropped, outages, bad mobile support. [0] https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/skype...

And it meant that random users' computers were being drafted into running a supernode and relaying traffic for other users, without permission or even any notice. Not only did this consume CPU time and bandwidth on the affected users' computers, but it also put anyone running a supernode in a position to observe and tamper with network traffic between other users.

Isn't that the point of having end-to-end encryption? I know Skype doesn't have that but perhaps that would have been a different solution

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#29
post #20

This is most probably a phishing attack.

You would think so but feel free to try a reset / recovery at live.com and you will see that this is their standard form. That's what is so absurd -- change an email with no verification, but require next-level verification for the original owner to secure the account.

Re: Tell HN: Microsoft Skype Security Is Flawed

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it meant that random users' computers were being drafted into running a supernode and relaying traffic for other users, without permission or even any notice. Not only did this consume CPU time and bandwidth on the affected users' computers, but it also put anyone running a supernode in a position to observe and tamper with network traffic between other users.

Isn't that the point of having end-to-end encryption? I know Skype doesn't have that but perhaps that would have been a different solution

End-to-end encryption reduces what an attacker in this position would be able to do, but it doesn't make the situation safe. Even if they can't observe or directly tamper with the data they're relaying, they can still observe metadata, like who the peers are and how much bandwidth is being relayed. Even just measuring the pattern of packet sizes can be disturbingly revealing:

https://www.cs.jhu.edu/~cwright/oakland08.pdf

Besides, end-to-end encryption doesn't do anything to allay concerns about abuse of users' resources.

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