It'll soon be illegal in Europe to differentiate insurance risk by gender... • Hacker News Board

Re: It'll soon be illegal in Europe to differentiate insurance risk by gender...

#21

Post by toretore » Tue, Mar 08, 2011, 11:59 AM UTC

echubb wrote: post #2

This has to be one of the most ridiculous rulings I've ever heard. Statistically, male drivers are more dangerous, so why should women now subsidise this behaviour? It's pure ideological lawmaking, designed to show how egalitarian the EU is by in fact foisting a law upon its citizens which is completely disconnected from reality. In their attempt to achieve "equality" and "fairness," they've actually achieved neither…

It seems to me your intention here was not to point out the perceived wrongness of this particular decision, but to provide "yet another case of Brussels bureaucrats meddling in our lives". In doing that, you're purposefully confusing the lawmaking and judiciary parts of the legal system to create an imagined body which you creatively name the "Eurocracy", while this was a court decision independent of those actually making the law. In short, your intention was to rant, using this ruling as an excuse, and not to provide potentially interesting information.

As for the ruling itself, I don't see what's wrong with it. It's gender discrimination, and gender discrimination is (IMO rightly) unlawful. I have never been in a car accident, I'm a careful and relatively safe driver and I don't appreciate having to pay more just because I happen to be male.

I'm sure you can come up with statistics that show people of a certain ethnicity are more likely to be in an accident too, but insurance companies know that's a no-go. Discriminating by gender is exactly the same; it's based on something you are that you can't change, unlike driving experience and where you live which you can.

Re: It'll soon be illegal in Europe to differentiate insurance risk by gender...

#22

Post by Roridge » Tue, Mar 08, 2011, 3:47 PM UTC

PHPAdam wrote: post #18

Roridge wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the long run everyone's insurance premiums go up. They wont reduce male drivers premiums because they "can't" so they will increase female ones. This ruling is terrible, I have been benefiting from having my girlfriend on my insurance for 10 years.

Why "can't" they? .. Happy to be proven wrong: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2298570

That is why I put it in quotes. They "can but wont" which translates to "We can't because insurance for men costs more because of the statistics". Given that rule of thumb they will increase females premiums.

Not only have I worked for insurance companies, but if I was one, this is exactly what I would do if I was told everyone had to be treated equally.

Re: It'll soon be illegal in Europe to differentiate insurance risk by gender...

#23

Post by Roridge » Tue, Mar 08, 2011, 3:49 PM UTC

PHPAdam wrote: post #17

echubb wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you figure? It's unlikely insurance companies will reduce their premiums for male drivers, they'll just increase the premiums for female customers.

Let me try and explain my maths, previously the fee where £100/£50 (M/F) income of £150. So they will have to increase F fee, so it will be (£100/£100) income of £200. Due to competition someone will then lower their fee to be (£75/£75) back again to £150 income. So in the long run, my statement stands, it will cost me less.

That is why I put it in quotes. They "can but wont" which translates to "We can't because insurance for men costs more because of the statistics [showing men have more claims therefore have to pay higher premiums]". Given that rule of thumb they will increase females premiums to make them equal.

Not only have I worked for insurance companies, but if I ran one, this is exactly what I would do if I was told everyone had to be treated equally. How can I charge men less if I know that they are going to make more claims?

Re: It'll soon be illegal in Europe to differentiate insurance risk by gender...

#24

Post by PHPAdam » Wed, Mar 09, 2011, 1:09 PM UTC

rcotton wrote: post #20

PHPAdam wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me try and explain my maths, previously the fee where £100/£50 (M/F) income of £150. So they will have to increase F fee, so it will be (£100/£100) income of £200. Due to competition someone will then lower their fee to be (£75/£75) back again to £150 income. So in the long run, my statement stands, it will cost me less.

I think you are seriously over-estimating the level of true competition in the UK Car Insurance Market. (hint; there are almost certainly less actual distinct insurance providers than you think...)

Yer, Just a few: http://www.gocompare.com/insurance-companies/

Their may have the same under-writers who set the same rates for every broker. Its the brokers were the competition is.