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Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

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Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#21
post #18
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it even on the roadmap? WASM does not have access to DOM at all.

I think it is.

No they are not. Standard DOM API is not i their roadmap. There is no point of doing it when WASM has to be loaded by JS anyway.

Currently DOM libraries using WASM are implemented by importing JS wrapper functions.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#22
post #5

A couple things I noticed when comparing to webpack: 1. This doesn’t bundle 2. This doesn’t support source maps

Come on, it clearly says it's not a bundler.

> Also...Zwitterion is NOT a bundler. It eschews bundling for a simpler experience.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#23
post #9

I can’t wait for WASM to kill off JS for mainstream web front end app dev. It can’t come soon enough. edit: Look at Blazor and Yew for example, these types of frameworks can and will replace the bulk of what we use JS for today.

I'm not sure where this idea has come from, but WASM is designed to run alongside Javascript. It isn't replacing it.

This.

It's funny tough, people are starting to pump giant runtimes over the air just to get C# running on the frontend, while people already complaining about JS bundle size smh.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#24
post #12

Can anyone point me to a workflow where the cognitive load is similar to how it was in the good old days? i.e. some thing that does everything for me apart from the bit where I write application and presentation code? That mostly just works and doesn't require me to understand the whole stack. Because when I switch to other languages/environments I can most remain blissfully unaware of the plumbing that keeps the thi…

Create-react-app is what you’re looking for.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#25
post #12

Can anyone point me to a workflow where the cognitive load is similar to how it was in the good old days? i.e. some thing that does everything for me apart from the bit where I write application and presentation code? That mostly just works and doesn't require me to understand the whole stack. Because when I switch to other languages/environments I can most remain blissfully unaware of the plumbing that keeps the thi…

Create-react-app is what you’re looking for.

But then you're forced to use React...and as soon as you need to do anything outside of what it provides it all falls apart which happens pretty quickly in my experience with it.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#26
post #21
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is.

No they are not. Standard DOM API is not i their roadmap. There is no point of doing it when WASM has to be loaded by JS anyway. Currently DOM libraries using WASM are implemented by importing JS wrapper functions.

The interface types proposal will allow to call DOM APIs from WebAssembly directly [https://github.com/WebAssembly/interface-types/blob/master/p...]

The point of doing it is of course performance.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#27
post #12

Can anyone point me to a workflow where the cognitive load is similar to how it was in the good old days? i.e. some thing that does everything for me apart from the bit where I write application and presentation code? That mostly just works and doesn't require me to understand the whole stack. Because when I switch to other languages/environments I can most remain blissfully unaware of the plumbing that keeps the thi…

Deploying JS (or anything) over the web usually requires a lot of extra considerations. Devs want flexibility in their deployment options, which is why Webpack is so complex.

Parcel is probably the closest to zero-config that I've seen. Only drawbacks are when you want to do something "off the rails". I'm guessing this project will be the same.

Of course, if you're not worried about supporting IE11, you could waive any built step and be absolutely fine. Gzip is more important than minifying.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#28
post #12

Can anyone point me to a workflow where the cognitive load is similar to how it was in the good old days? i.e. some thing that does everything for me apart from the bit where I write application and presentation code? That mostly just works and doesn't require me to understand the whole stack. Because when I switch to other languages/environments I can most remain blissfully unaware of the plumbing that keeps the thi…

Vanilla JS? For most purposes I find that all these frameworks are simply unnecessary . As a bonus, all the debugging tools in Chrome work much better when there's no obfuscation or packing, and "recompiling" is just Ctrl-R. Code size and load speed is also massively better than it would otherwise be. Pages load instantly. It's nirvana, I tell you.

In my experience that results in the team building an inferior, untested, undocumented, and buggy version of React|Vue|jQuery|lodash. Now you need to train new peeps to handle that mess. And you haven’t even started solving actual problems.

Provided you really need so much bulk at your disposal. But that’s a different story.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#29
post #12

Can anyone point me to a workflow where the cognitive load is similar to how it was in the good old days? i.e. some thing that does everything for me apart from the bit where I write application and presentation code? That mostly just works and doesn't require me to understand the whole stack. Because when I switch to other languages/environments I can most remain blissfully unaware of the plumbing that keeps the thi…

Ember.js is very much batteries-included although learning the framework definitely requires a time investment.

Re: Zwitterion: a web dev server that lets you import anything

#30
post #10

I wonder if someone quantified the millions of hours wasted by OCD bikeshedders moving their projects over to the latest, not-necessarily better new thing offering vague utility improvements over the thing that was just starting to feel comfortable... if the JS community would stop churning their north star toolset every 18-24 months. Seriously: it's like you're trying to nuke the moon. This is why people legitimatel…

Awesome with new ideas and approaches to things. Just because someone have taken time to solve things differently does not automagically imply that this is something that forces someone to throw old stuff out. Strange comment IMO.

> Strange comment IMO.

You must be new to JS then. Come revisit your reply when you try and work on any JS project no one has touched for a year.

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