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Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

cnbc.com

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Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#21

Post by tracer4201 »

alttab wrote: post #9
tristanstcyr wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does this cause more stuff to be consumed?

I think the implication is that it doesn't seem like the path taken by Bezos is to have people consume less, but to make deliveries more carbon neutral.

I mean - less consumption is a topic even bigger than Amazon. The US economy has consumption as its very foundation. It’s not clear what we would turn to.

Step 1 is to do what you’re doing now but in a more sustainable way. Remember, our current state is we are debating whether we even ought to make change in the first place.

The larger shift to less consumption overall isn’t something we can achieve in 5 years. It’s more of a marathon that’ll take 20-30 years.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#22

Post by notJim »

pleatedwaffle wrote: post #13

Is there any chance this will make Rivian Trucks cheaper? I really want one.

The company has been around for 10 years without shipping a product. To me the bigger question is whether you'll ever be able to buy one. By contrast, Tesla started in 2003 and shipped the Roadster in 2008 and the Model S in 2012.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#26

Post by Nasrudith »

Arubis wrote: post #6

I'm glad to see that there's deliberate movement in this direction. However, it's a little dismaying that the headline is implying that we can address climate change by Consuming More Stuff; that's how we got into this mess in the first place.

To be fair proper "infastructure" (in quotes because things like farming equipment also qualifies) is the one form of consumption that actually helps - it may be worse than a "nirvana" but it is practically the only way to advance. Better is better: it is a tautology but an important one.

Ironically China saw improvements in air quality by moving people from huts with fire cooking to apartments with gas or coal fired electric.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#27

Post by mumblemumble »

noonespecial wrote: post #17
Arubis wrote: post #6

I'm glad to see that there's deliberate movement in this direction. However, it's a little dismaying that the headline is implying that we can address climate change by Consuming More Stuff; that's how we got into this mess in the first place.

While I largely agree with you, decades on it seems that if the message factors down to "quick, everybody stop doing stuff" , it's hard to get political traction. Every step in the right direction is a good one. Perfect is the enemy of good.

Unstated major premise: Buying electric vans is a step in the right direction in the first place.

I'm thinking here of the lessons we've been learning recently about recycling: It would appear that we now need to come to terms with the possibility that recycling has done far more harm than good, by making it easier to justify excessive packaging waste while at the same time mostly only giving consumers the impression that what they put in the recycle bin wasn't going to waste.

I could see something similar happening with electric delivery vans: Perhaps, by ostensibly greening the most consumer-visible part of the process, they can make them feel better about buying into a way of getting their consumer products that relies on a much less efficient supply chain than the one used by the system it's supplanting.

Perhaps, if we dig into it, we'll discover that Amazon is being pennywise here, because properly dealing with the pounds would require rolling back the "free 2 day shipping of pretty much anything to pretty much anywhere" guarantee that underlies so much of Amazon's current business model.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#28

Post by Reedx »

Arubis wrote: post #6

I'm glad to see that there's deliberate movement in this direction. However, it's a little dismaying that the headline is implying that we can address climate change by Consuming More Stuff; that's how we got into this mess in the first place.

Well, they're not really buying more if they were going to add 100k vans to the fleet regardless? Assuming that's the case, it's just that those will be electric instead of ICE.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#29

Post by gambiting »

tristanstcyr wrote: post #8
Arubis wrote: post #6

I'm glad to see that there's deliberate movement in this direction. However, it's a little dismaying that the headline is implying that we can address climate change by Consuming More Stuff; that's how we got into this mess in the first place.

Why does this cause more stuff to be consumed?

I think it's because the environmental cost of making a brand new electric van has a higher environmental cost than just driving the van you already have until it dies. Basically the world would be better off if people stopped buying new vehicles tomorrow completely, and just drove whatever they have, no matter how polluting it is - it's still better on the planet than making a new one. Of course our economy doesn't work that way and it's a completely unworkable solution for now - so replacing ICE vans with electric ones is second best solution.

Re: Jeff Bezos climate change plan unveiled – buy 100k electric vans.

#30

Post by [deleted] »

martythemaniak wrote: post #16
Arubis wrote: post #6

I'm glad to see that there's deliberate movement in this direction. However, it's a little dismaying that the headline is implying that we can address climate change by Consuming More Stuff; that's how we got into this mess in the first place.

Climate change is not about consuming less. It is about not taking carbon from the ground and putting it in the atmosphere.

[deleted]
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