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Google's software mistreats or harms the user

gnu.org

21–30 of 291 posts

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#21
The "censorship software" point is extremely dumb.

I have kids. I want them to have a phone for communication purposes when they move from place to place (come back from school). I also want the to lock down the phone so if they sneak it out or something, they can't watch it for 12 straight hours.

That's it. That's what this does.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#22

> Google/Alphabet intentionally broke Revolv home automatic control products that depended on a server to function, by shutting down the server. The lesson is, reject all such products. Insist on self-contained computers that run free software! The last two sentences seem a little pretentious. The people who bought these products don't know (or want to take the time to learn) how to use git or edit config files or in…

One technical person could make this work for everyone else.

I have a few pieces of hardware right now that are "broken" because the companies that made them went of business. These products have millions of owners. With the source code and encryption keys I could personally make this hardware work for those users indefinitely. And there are hundreds (if not thousands) of users just like me.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#23

The "censorship software" point is extremely dumb. I have kids. I want them to have a phone for communication purposes when they move from place to place (come back from school). I also want the to lock down the phone so if they sneak it out or something, they can't watch it for 12 straight hours. That's it. That's what this does.

I am not commenting on you directly, but, in general, I find the kind of control that the Google parental control app gives to be excessive. It makes talking unnecessary and gives a direct window to a personal dimension of the kid. You really have a total power over the kids phone and activity. I get the reasons to install this on the phone of a child, but at the same time I'm afraid that it might be too much and that it might give to the kids the sensation of being watched by the parent all the time. Respecting their spaces, having their own dimensions that is out of the eye of the parent is also important, in my opinion.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#24
post #4

All of this is trivially and obviously true to power users of GNU/Linux systems. My machine does precisely what I want, when I want it, in the way that I want it. If it doesn't, within reasonable constraints like physical possibility, I can open a text editor, and make it do so. Sure, that might take me a long time. I can add almost all of this configuration to stuff like git repos; back it up; transfer it between co…

If you have an android phone then you probably can automate that: https://llamalab.com/automate/ USB tethering is specifically listed under features, presumably there's some API that developers have access to. Apparently by use of the class WifiManager in android.net.wifi you can programmatically change the state of USB tethering without any kind of special privileges.

Or try AOSP, while imperfect its closer to GNU.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#25
Almost all of this is heavily exaggerated, presenting relatively innocuous features as if they were harmful, or calling out simple bugs as if they were intentional and actively malicious. None of it is flat-out wrong per-se (at least as far as I can tell), and I can certainly see where GNU is coming from, but I think for the average user most of the features they're criticizing actually do a lot more good than harm.

Just a few examples, to demonstrate my point:

- They describe Google's demonstrated ability to remove malware from user's devices as a "backdoor"

- They describe parental controls as "censorship"

- They consider the fact that Android supports DRM "malware"

- They cite the fact that Android malware exists as a security flaw. (Ignoring the fact that there is basically no OS in existence that can't be infected with malware.)

- They consider the ability for users to remotely reset their Android lockscreen combo if they know their Google account password a "back door"

- They describe a bug where Google Assistant incorrectly identified the "Okay Google" hotword as "Google Assistant recording users' conversations"

- They describe the fact that a Google message app doesn't delete conversations until the user asks it to as "surveillance"

Again, I'm not saying this point of view is necessarily wrong. From a certain point of view, all of the claims I described above are actually quite logical. (I even find myself agreeing with some of them.) But from the perspective of the average user, the vast majority of this stuff simply isn't worth worrying about, and I think it's a little extreme to characterize it as "malware". Just something to keep in mind.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#27

As an Android user, what are some ways that I can deal with the problems addressed here? (I already do a number of things, but I’m curious what everyone else does.)

Ignore this list and find a better one that actually represents the issues fairly.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#28
post #13
post #6

What is interesting about this and the Apple post[1] is that no one is actually taking responsibility or signing their name. It's just a generic blog post with a list of issues. Where is the GNU's "open" log of who is publishing this info? Without a source, I can't really verify if the author has some ulterior motive. [1] https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/malware-apple.html

The author has an ulterior motive, which is that to advance the agenda of the FSF*.

I'm not sure that's ulterior.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#29

The "censorship software" point is extremely dumb. I have kids. I want them to have a phone for communication purposes when they move from place to place (come back from school). I also want the to lock down the phone so if they sneak it out or something, they can't watch it for 12 straight hours. That's it. That's what this does.

I am not commenting on you directly, but, in general, I find the kind of control that the Google parental control app gives to be excessive. It makes talking unnecessary and gives a direct window to a personal dimension of the kid. You really have a total power over the kids phone and activity. I get the reasons to install this on the phone of a child, but at the same time I'm afraid that it might be too much and tha…

To further specify: go read the user reviews of the kids in Google Play Store for the app. Apart from being hilarious, they are actually quite sad and I understand, in part, their points.

Re: Google's software mistreats or harms the user

#30
post #25

Almost all of this is heavily exaggerated, presenting relatively innocuous features as if they were harmful, or calling out simple bugs as if they were intentional and actively malicious. None of it is flat-out wrong per-se (at least as far as I can tell), and I can certainly see where GNU is coming from, but I think for the average user most of the features they're criticizing actually do a lot more good than harm.…

The average user certainly doesn't worry about any of this, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't.

The worst, of course, is the tragedy of the commons dynamics. A lot of harm that comes from surveillance capitalism does not affect someone in particular, but it amounts to great damage to society as a whole. For example, by degrading public discourse, addicting people to screen time while robbing them of living their actual lives, and assisting authoritarian regimes in oppressing their own people (project dragonfly).

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