Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline • Hacker News Board

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#21

Post by fwip » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

agarden wrote: post #15

hedora wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

You talk as if this were an unforeseen consequence of the way our legislature is set up. It is not. Giving the people who live in sparsely populated areas an equal voice with those who live in densely populated areas is the whole point of the Senate. It was designed to work this way and it is doing exactly what it was meant to do.

Sure, but it's a bad design.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#22

Post by DamnYuppie » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

ijpoijpoihpiuoh wrote: post #2

Perhaps this makes me a terrible person, but I sometimes half hope to see things like this go through. The people of Alaska asked for this, and it will be interesting to see if they like getting what they asked for. The main reason it's only "half-hope" rather than fully hoping is that the damage from this will still affect people who didn't vote in favor of it. Those kids at the university deserve a better education…

The one thing I have not seen mentioned here at all is that a great portion of the cost of Universities is now being consumed by administrative personnel. It is possible that this will force the university to be more cost conscious without a great decrease in the quality of their education offered.

I get the sense that the comments here equate a reduction in budget to annihilation of higher education. I find this to be a bit extreme as there needs to be a reasonable conversation about the cost of that education and what resources and personnel are really required to deliver it and are the students/society really getting value for their money at current prices.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#23

Post by aaron-santos » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:51 PM UTC

agarden wrote: post #15

hedora wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

You talk as if this were an unforeseen consequence of the way our legislature is set up. It is not. Giving the people who live in sparsely populated areas an equal voice with those who live in densely populated areas is the whole point of the Senate. It was designed to work this way and it is doing exactly what it was meant to do.

At what point does it stop making sense? We exist on a continuum somewhere between states having equal population on one side and 1 person per state and 1 state with everyone else on the other. It feels like we're moving toward the latter. Especially since the way the senate rules are structured it only takes 20.5 low population states to block everything.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#24

Post by Frondo » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:51 PM UTC

agarden wrote: post #15

hedora wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

You talk as if this were an unforeseen consequence of the way our legislature is set up. It is not. Giving the people who live in sparsely populated areas an equal voice with those who live in densely populated areas is the whole point of the Senate. It was designed to work this way and it is doing exactly what it was meant to do.

Land doesn't vote. Those people should have an equal voice -- that's a democracy I can get behind whole-hog. They don't. They have an immensely outsized voice based entirely on geographical distance to one another.

Proximity to your fellow citizens shouldn't lessen your voice, yet here we are.

And anything designed to be that antidemocratic should be recognized as such, and those of us who do care about democracy should be fighting and organizing every day to disband it and replace it with something fair.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#25

Post by mlevental » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:51 PM UTC

ijpoijpoihpiuoh wrote: post #2

Perhaps this makes me a terrible person, but I sometimes half hope to see things like this go through. The people of Alaska asked for this, and it will be interesting to see if they like getting what they asked for. The main reason it's only "half-hope" rather than fully hoping is that the damage from this will still affect people who didn't vote in favor of it. Those kids at the university deserve a better education…

there are two countervailing forces to them "learning their lesson" : memory is short and this fact that you allude

>But I'd be a fool to believe that you can take budgetary changes and trailing economic results in isolation. The system is far more complicated than that.

is exploited by those with a vested interest to place blame elsewhere

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#26

Post by analog31 » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:52 PM UTC

ijpoijpoihpiuoh wrote: post #2

Perhaps this makes me a terrible person, but I sometimes half hope to see things like this go through. The people of Alaska asked for this, and it will be interesting to see if they like getting what they asked for. The main reason it's only "half-hope" rather than fully hoping is that the damage from this will still affect people who didn't vote in favor of it. Those kids at the university deserve a better education…

This would require more detailed analysis. Did the people really ask for it? Does the election system in Alaska result in a government with a connection to public sentiment?

I live in a heavily gerrymandered state, so it's not even clear what it means to say that we have an elected government.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#27

Post by pbreit » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:54 PM UTC

Unpopular opinion: there's probably a lot of fat to be cut and this is possibly the only way to do it.

Prediction: The most customer-unfriendly trimming will come first.

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#28

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:54 PM UTC

agarden wrote: post #15

hedora wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

You talk as if this were an unforeseen consequence of the way our legislature is set up. It is not. Giving the people who live in sparsely populated areas an equal voice with those who live in densely populated areas is the whole point of the Senate. It was designed to work this way and it is doing exactly what it was meant to do.

[deleted]

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#29

Post by jupiter90000 » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:55 PM UTC

hedora wrote: post #8

ijpoijpoihpiuoh wrote: post #2

Perhaps this makes me a terrible person, but I sometimes half hope to see things like this go through. The people of Alaska asked for this, and it will be interesting to see if they like getting what they asked for. The main reason it's only "half-hope" rather than fully hoping is that the damage from this will still affect people who didn't vote in favor of it. Those kids at the university deserve a better education…

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

The ironic thing here is the presumedly Republican majority (of voters) voting for a guy promising what amounts to a monetary handout. But are typically vehemently opposed to government handouts?

Re: Blindsided by a Devastating Veto, Alaska University System Pleads for Lifeline

#30

Post by mtberatwork » Mon, Jul 08, 2019, 4:58 PM UTC

agarden wrote: post #15

hedora wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On problem with saying “that red state asked for it; let them see how they like it when their kids are starving on the streets (since they will also vote against welfare)” is that the US counts votes in a way that means, as more people flee your conservative hell-hole to find work, the remaining people’s votes count more and more. Demographic projections say that the senate will be controlled by Make no mistake about…

You talk as if this were an unforeseen consequence of the way our legislature is set up. It is not. Giving the people who live in sparsely populated areas an equal voice with those who live in densely populated areas is the whole point of the Senate. It was designed to work this way and it is doing exactly what it was meant to do.

That wasn't the "whole" point of the Senate:

"The other was intended to represent the states to such extent as they retained their sovereignty except for the powers expressly delegated to the national government. The Senate was thus not designed to serve the people of the United States equally." [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate