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Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

bbc.com

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Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#21

Post by yasp »

PaulRobinson wrote: post #19
yasp wrote: post #8

Craig Murray's reaction is worth reading [1]. I realize he does not respond to the bail breach directly, but rather to what precipitated this chain of events. > If the Swedish allegations against Julian Assange were genuine and not simply a ruse to arrest him for extradition to the United States, where is the arrest warrant now from Sweden and what are the charges? > Only the more minor allegation has passed the stat…

Referring to "Blairite MPs" in this context is so laughable it undermines this person as a serious political commentator.

Craig Murray is a former British ambassador.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#22

Post by akvadrako »

yasp wrote: post #8

Craig Murray's reaction is worth reading [1]. I realize he does not respond to the bail breach directly, but rather to what precipitated this chain of events. > If the Swedish allegations against Julian Assange were genuine and not simply a ruse to arrest him for extradition to the United States, where is the arrest warrant now from Sweden and what are the charges? > Only the more minor allegation has passed the stat…

To be fair, this seems like a dishonest account of the situation. My understanding is that being "charged" in Sweden normally happens later in the process than in the USA/UK, so the fact that he wasn't "charged" isn't meaningful.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#23

Post by akvadrako »

yasp wrote: post #20
Veen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to Murray's questions is in the article. Prosecutors dropped the rape investigation in 2017 because they were unable to formally notify him of allegations while he was staying in the embassy. They are considering re-opening the investigation.

So was a warrant issued or not? In the US, at least, being "unable to formally notify [someone] of allegations" would not prevent a warrant from being issued.

This is not the US, so US legal customs are irrelevant.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#24

Post by _petronius »

yasp wrote: post #8

Craig Murray's reaction is worth reading [1]. I realize he does not respond to the bail breach directly, but rather to what precipitated this chain of events. > If the Swedish allegations against Julian Assange were genuine and not simply a ruse to arrest him for extradition to the United States, where is the arrest warrant now from Sweden and what are the charges? > Only the more minor allegation has passed the stat…

This whole "if the accusation is real then why hasn't he been charged?" pseudo-fact relies on a rather stubborn misunderstanding of the difference between the Swedish legal system and the UK one. Assange can't be "charged" in the sense that the Anglosphere thinks of it until he is physically present for trail; that doesn't mean that the charges haven't been put to him or that Sweden isn't actively pursuing the investigation.

Much of the commentary around the legal aspects of Assange's case it misleading or outright false.

See:

1. (2012) https://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/media/2012/09/legal-mytho...

2. (2019) https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/11165977611288453...

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#25

Post by yasp »

akvadrako wrote: post #23
yasp wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So was a warrant issued or not? In the US, at least, being "unable to formally notify [someone] of allegations" would not prevent a warrant from being issued.

This is not the US, so US legal customs are irrelevant.

Right. So OP may kindly cite Swedish legal process or refrain from expressing an opinion.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#26

Post by evilmoo »

yasp wrote: post #20
Veen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to Murray's questions is in the article. Prosecutors dropped the rape investigation in 2017 because they were unable to formally notify him of allegations while he was staying in the embassy. They are considering re-opening the investigation.

So was a warrant issued or not? In the US, at least, being "unable to formally notify [someone] of allegations" would not prevent a warrant from being issued.

This isn't in the US.

There are many differences between the US and EU/UK.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#27

Post by Veen »

yasp wrote: post #20
Veen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to Murray's questions is in the article. Prosecutors dropped the rape investigation in 2017 because they were unable to formally notify him of allegations while he was staying in the embassy. They are considering re-opening the investigation.

So was a warrant issued or not? In the US, at least, being "unable to formally notify [someone] of allegations" would not prevent a warrant from being issued.

A warrant was issued, but while he was in the embassy the Swedish government couldn't serve him with a notification of it.

Top prosecutor Marianne Ny said his arrest warrant was being revoked as it was impossible to serve him notice.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-39973864

You are unlikely to come to sound conclusions if you reason on the basis of your knowledge of US law. Sweden is not the US.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#28

Post by guitarbill »

Veen wrote: post #18
guitarbill wrote: post #7

> His continued residence at the embassy and bringing him to justice had cost taxpayers £16m, she [Judge Deborah Taylor] added. Disgracefully dishonest in multiple ways. Not to mention, the police force's continued incompetence should have no bearing (maybe it didn't).

You haven't said what is dishonest? Did they do their sums wrong? Did it not cost £16m?

To imply he was responsible or even warranted such an expensive operation is ludicrous. Second, it's bad - but not unexpected - that the US' secret arrest warrant, which it turns out did exist, was not factored in.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#29

Post by lucideer »

akvadrako wrote: post #22
yasp wrote: post #8

Craig Murray's reaction is worth reading [1]. I realize he does not respond to the bail breach directly, but rather to what precipitated this chain of events. > If the Swedish allegations against Julian Assange were genuine and not simply a ruse to arrest him for extradition to the United States, where is the arrest warrant now from Sweden and what are the charges? > Only the more minor allegation has passed the stat…

To be fair, this seems like a dishonest account of the situation. My understanding is that being "charged" in Sweden normally happens later in the process than in the USA/UK, so the fact that he wasn't "charged" isn't meaningful.

To be fair, you've nitpicked one minor detail in the above quote. The subtantive point still hands. Why is Assange not now wanted for questioning in Sweden?

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#30

Post by cyphar »

Gaelan wrote: post #4
sschueller wrote: post #2

While I am saddened by this decision I hope he now is able to get proper medical care and fight the case against extradition. As long as he is not on London streets the US can't just snatch him up. [1] [2] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Omar_case

Has the US ever “snatched up” someone from the middle of London?

Not in London, but GP linked two examples (one in Macedonia and one in Italy). There are also many other examples of CIA-run extraordinary rendition[1].

However in these cases they were both done with co-operation from the local police (or military) and government as part of the US "war on terror" (abductions without local government approval have also happened in the past -- Mossad did this in the 1960s[2] -- but I don't recall a US example).

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_rendition [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Eichmann#Capture

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