People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours • Hacker News Board

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#21

Post by arosier » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:42 PM UTC

This happened to me. I was working 40 hours per week but saying I was working 75 hours per week (without really measuring it). Then I got a second job which made it more important to manage my time effectively (including measuring my time). With the second job, I actually started working 72 hours per week and realized how hard it is to work that much time due to the necessities in life (sleeping, eating/shopping, bathing, commuting, ect) not to mention all the distractions that come up during work when you think you have more then 40 hours to complete all your work.

I recommend anyone try to work that much for a few months, it really puts perspective on how limited our time is and the value of time management.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#22

Post by haolez » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:45 PM UTC

osrec wrote: post #14

Investment bankers will often claim this, while also lying about their salary. I was often surprised by my colleagues claiming extra long work weeks, all while looking remarkable fresh. I couldn't work it out - I mean, if I worked a solid 14 hour day, you could see it clearly on my face, yet if they do it, they seem to develop a healthy glow. Turns out a lot of them were in the building, but not at their desk. Oftent…

On the other side, I know some investment bankers and they work more than 60 hours per week. They look unhealthy to me :)

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#23

Post by Scoundreller » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:49 PM UTC

ridgewell wrote: post #8

ska wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hence some of the dysfunction in medicine.

Medicine is an interesting case. The prioritization isn't so much on the health of medical practitioners and nurses, but on patient safety. It is argued that patients have higher survivability rates when patient handoffs/shift changes are kept to a minimum. The focus has never been on the health of doctors, nurses, X-Ray technicians, etc. but from a public health perspective. This has far-reaching consequences in its…

The nurses may be working 12 hour shifts, but they’re unlikely to work more than 4 in a week. Overtime is expensive for employers, so they prefer to hire more or hire contract nurses where necessary.

Even the doctors usually cover 12 clinical 12hr shifts a month. They may do more work after another takes over, academic work, moonlight, or have admin work.

And having a good income allows you to buy your way out of most modern problems/work, like comparison shopping, cleaning, or even having and then raising their children for them.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#24

Post by scott_s » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:49 PM UTC

mwfunk wrote: post #13

In my experience, when a workplace has a perpetual crunch time culture, little if any additional work gets done that wouldn't have gotten done if everyone stuck to 40 hour weeks. I'm very curious how true this is in 996 places. When someone knows that they're going to spend 12 hours in the office regardless of how much work is actually required, that time gets padded out a LOT with non-work stuff, both to preserve th…

For those who also were not familiar with 996: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#25

Post by WalterSear » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:51 PM UTC

danielb12345 wrote: post #18

mwfunk wrote: post #13

In my experience, when a workplace has a perpetual crunch time culture, little if any additional work gets done that wouldn't have gotten done if everyone stuck to 40 hour weeks. I'm very curious how true this is in 996 places. When someone knows that they're going to spend 12 hours in the office regardless of how much work is actually required, that time gets padded out a LOT with non-work stuff, both to preserve th…

I heard from people who work in that culture that it is more for show. Most people still browse YouTube/Reddit and stuff. When everything is an emergency, nothing is an emergency.

I've worked in that environment, but without anyone goofing off. Fortunately, as a contractor, I did not have to come in on the weekends.

My coworkers were no more productive than me: IMNSHO, they would end up dragging as much busywork out of every problem as they could, simply because they were too overworked to think more than one step ahead.

To wit: we were running 10 AWS servers - to serve a mostly static website and handle a few hundred REST API calls each day.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#26

Post by sergers » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:52 PM UTC

osrec wrote: post #14

Investment bankers will often claim this, while also lying about their salary. I was often surprised by my colleagues claiming extra long work weeks, all while looking remarkable fresh. I couldn't work it out - I mean, if I worked a solid 14 hour day, you could see it clearly on my face, yet if they do it, they seem to develop a healthy glow. Turns out a lot of them were in the building, but not at their desk. Oftent…

I have a colleague who works 14 hour days.

This includes an hour nap in his car, lunch for 2 hours, and running errands/personal things outside the office for a few more hours.

If he sat down and worked straight, we figured he would only need to be in the office no more than 8 hours

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#27

Post by ska » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:53 PM UTC

ridgewell wrote: post #8

ska wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hence some of the dysfunction in medicine.

Medicine is an interesting case. The prioritization isn't so much on the health of medical practitioners and nurses, but on patient safety. It is argued that patients have higher survivability rates when patient handoffs/shift changes are kept to a minimum. The focus has never been on the health of doctors, nurses, X-Ray technicians, etc. but from a public health perspective. This has far-reaching consequences in its…

Yes, I've heard that argument before. I've asked before if the research shows the problem is handoffs per se, or the protocol around them, but haven't had a good answer. There also doesn't seem to be good research into the longer term impact of these negative consequences on the practitioners.

I've worked around clinicians and clinical staff, and several times been surprised how much is left to personal memory and scheduling, including some inherently risky protocols/procedures that are at all functional only because the people doing them are careful ... some of these obviously easily improvable.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#28

Post by badpun » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:55 PM UTC

Theodores wrote: post #12

What is work anyway? If you are a programmer then work is different. Sure you are not on your feet all day at the beck and call of customers, however, if you are not working then your computer is. Waiting is not supposed to be part of the job. Learning on the job is also verboten. Very little time that is on the company clock is spent travelling. I have colleagues in sales that do lots of travel, then, when they are…

Work is every activity you take to further the goals of your employer. So, traveling is work, waiting for a build is work, learning new tech required for the job is work etc. The caveat is that not all work is equally demanding and tiring - so, if for example your job consists of a lot of travel, you could negotiate a lower hourly rate for the time you spend traveling.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#29

Post by mdorazio » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:55 PM UTC

rogerkirkness wrote: post #2

Actually working more than ~55 hours in a week is soul crushing and physically very hard. At a certain point you would need an escalation of stimulants or risk not being able to get out of bed if you actually worked 75 hours.

I can confirm. In the consulting world I've had several instances of either being doubled up on projects or having to hit extremely demanding deadlines for milestone payouts that required legitimate 60+ hour weeks. One week is doable, 2 is a stretch, beyond that people (myself included) generally had to turn to things like modafinil to keep going and there's a noticeable toll on general health and wellness.

On the flip side, people who say they work stupid hours are usually just at the office stupid hours, not necessarily working all the time. But so are people who say they work 40 hour weeks. From working with hundreds of "normal" employees at clients over the years, I'd say the average actual productive time per person is around 25 hours.

Re: People Who Claim to Work 75-Hour Weeks Usually Only Work About 50 Hours

#30

Post by dclusin » Thu, Apr 25, 2019, 7:55 PM UTC

osrec wrote: post #14

Investment bankers will often claim this, while also lying about their salary. I was often surprised by my colleagues claiming extra long work weeks, all while looking remarkable fresh. I couldn't work it out - I mean, if I worked a solid 14 hour day, you could see it clearly on my face, yet if they do it, they seem to develop a healthy glow. Turns out a lot of them were in the building, but not at their desk. Oftent…

Investment banking interns have turned up dead from exhaustion. So some of them probably do work a lot. I can see it more so than engineering because deals are so time sensitive, you really can't slack off if there's a deal on. But agreed, most are probably full of shit :)