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Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

theintercept.com

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Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#21

Post by dalbasal »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #16
dalbasal wrote: post #11

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess. That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols? "Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program. It would be…

Fundamentally, I think we need two key concepts: - US equivalent of GDPR: A law that would guarantee us the right to control data about us, be informed of data collected on us, and request a copy or delete that data. The critical impact here is to protect our privacy with regards to corporations . - A generally-defined right to privacy: The EU enshrines privacy as a fundamental human right, the US equivalent would be…

Parts of the gdpr are good. Imo, these are mostly the data security elements (leak reporting to users and legal barriers data selling).

The consent/privacy elements are near useless, imo. In practice, they amount to a "we value your privacy" notice. I don't think individually "negotiated" consent for users visiting a website or downloading an app is useful or privacy promoting. It just amounts to "tick this box to use this app," most of the time. Other times, there is a UI actively directing the large majority of people away from the rational choice.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#22

Post by duxup »

soared wrote: post #20
duxup wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm working on a side project and the setup is basically that you get to see all the data I have on you. Granted this is a tiny project that is largely just for me, but as a policy that seems like that is the most clear cut way to go.

The big data players have tools for this. For example: https://datacloudoptout.oracle.com/registry/

That's interesting, I wonder how that came about.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#23

Post by duxup »

JohnFen wrote: post #18
duxup wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm working on a side project and the setup is basically that you get to see all the data I have on you. Granted this is a tiny project that is largely just for me, but as a policy that seems like that is the most clear cut way to go.

But could I both delete the data you have and tell you not to collect more? Transparency is great, but all by itself it means little.

Yeah I don't see why not.

Generally just showing all the data is there to inform, and then the user can not participate or say as you ask delete.

I was thinking I'd put a delay on the actual deleting of data to prevent something malicious.

Granted this is all just a personal side project primarily for my personal use and education ;)

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#24

Post by ocdtrekkie »

dalbasal wrote: post #21
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fundamentally, I think we need two key concepts: - US equivalent of GDPR: A law that would guarantee us the right to control data about us, be informed of data collected on us, and request a copy or delete that data. The critical impact here is to protect our privacy with regards to corporations . - A generally-defined right to privacy: The EU enshrines privacy as a fundamental human right, the US equivalent would be…

Parts of the gdpr are good. Imo, these are mostly the data security elements (leak reporting to users and legal barriers data selling). The consent/privacy elements are near useless, imo. In practice, they amount to a "we value your privacy" notice. I don't think individually "negotiated" consent for users visiting a website or downloading an app is useful or privacy promoting. It just amounts to "tick this box to us…

I disagree wholeheartedly. In many cases the "tick this box to use this app" is not GDPR compliant, and once more enforcement is done, you'll see this pattern diminish or go away. Businesses will eventually transition away from surveillance capitalism, as it becomes increasingly less profitable and it's visibility makes products using it increasingly less appealing to consumers.

Furthermore, GDPR is already in effect in the EU, and multinational companies already have to follow it. There's no reason for us to fail to implement all of GDPR, since so many already have to implement all of it anyways.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#25

Post by 420codebro »

4ntonius8lock wrote: post #7
ignoramous wrote: post #5

The fact that a 100% of the think-tanks taking corporate funding (from the likes of Microsoft, Amazon, Twitter, Facebook, Google, Airbnb, Uber, Verizon, eBay) are trying to undermine excellent privacy laws passed by California [0] and Illinois state assemblies should come as a surprise to no one. The problem is these think-tanks or variants thereof might end up representing the tech industry in most places where it m…

Is there any law/legal mechanism which could put automatic expiration on new laws? Is there anything I could suggest to my lawmakers for this to happen? I mean, we seem to be following a pattern: Big power wants something that directly and negatively impact the quality of life of the majority of the populace. Populace rises up against this. Big power 'loses'. Big power makes the push again next year. People rise up,…

Yup it is possible. See the Assault Weapon Ban from 1994 to 2004.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#26

Post by mLuby »

TL;DR: the key is to insulate lawmakers from concentrations of wealth.

A law that prevents corporations from spending resources on politics would do this. Or low contribution limits could work, to limit billionaire influence.

A lot of comments in this and other privacy threads correctly worry about the combination of "diffuse costs, concentrated benefits" and the electorate's short attention vs sustained private lobbying. My feeling is those effects cannot be overcome once in effect, so we have to roll back to prevent the effects in the first place.

Sounds politically unlikely, but stranger things have happened in American politics.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#27

Post by amalcon »

dalbasal wrote: post #11

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess. That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols? "Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program. It would be…

I think the biggest problem here is that nobody can agree on the sort of information that they want to protect. Obviously everyone is fine with these organizations collecting their forum posts (this is the whole point). Likewise, few want these organizations collecting unauthorized photos by way of laptop cameras. There seems to be some legitimate disagreement on whether organizations should be allowed to collect e.g. your browsing history.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#28

Post by soared »

duxup wrote: post #22
soared wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big data players have tools for this. For example: https://datacloudoptout.oracle.com/registry/

That's interesting, I wonder how that came about.

Yeah kind of cool. I believe tools like that came from either mass opt-out tools by the Network Advertising Initiative or the Digital Advertising Alliance.

http://optout.networkadvertising.org/?c=1

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#29

Post by nerdjon »

I wish I could say I was surprised by this... but I am not.

What I am really curious about, are any of these companies linked to Apple?

Considering the very public stance they have been recently taking. The article does not specifically mention them either way (and they are the only of the big ones missing).

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#30

Post by bduerst »

soared wrote: post #19
raxxorrax wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the best approach to informational self-determination is to define that any information concerning you as a person belongs to yourself. Any diversion needs active consent. This is what this think tank (a name for every sweaty office) allegedly wants to get rid off. I doubt this clear definition is impractical or utopian and could very well be implemented, so I doubt effective privacy legislation needs to be e…

> any information concerning you as a person belongs to yourself. Any diversion needs active consent But in the US that isn't true even outside of the internet. If you walk outside of your home/land, I can legally photograph and record video of you. I can write down what you're wearing, make assumptions about your income based on your address, record you gender/age/etc. All of that is 100% legal - you willingly give…

Exactly. What if I remember seeing you somewhere? Do I need to forget that information if you ask me to, because it's information about you and you own it?
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