How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
21–30 of 38 posts
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#22I think the bigger debate is whether eugenics or anti-dysgenics should be a policy goal of the government. Whether we like it or not - if we don't pass our best genes down to our children we are hurting future generations. I suspect the fact that we've turned so against eugenics goes hand in hand with the fact that we've also destroyed the environment, the financial well-being, and even the mental health of the next…
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#23Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#24I think the bigger debate is whether eugenics or anti-dysgenics should be a policy goal of the government. Whether we like it or not - if we don't pass our best genes down to our children we are hurting future generations. I suspect the fact that we've turned so against eugenics goes hand in hand with the fact that we've also destroyed the environment, the financial well-being, and even the mental health of the next…
I find different cultures/religions to be quite interesting in their characteristics of families. Mormons seem to have larger families. They require 10% of income goes to the church which increases the church's influence, so the church gets stronger the more people are in it. It's like a self-sustaining organism that gets stronger with each generation.
As an intelligent individual belonging to no particular culture or religion, I feel less inclined to have children than others I know since it's not part of my values. It's likely that people like myself are going to have a difficult time passing on our genetics. If you want to encourage smart people to have kids, create a religion/culture that makes sense to them and give them that directive.
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#25I think the bigger debate is whether eugenics or anti-dysgenics should be a policy goal of the government. Whether we like it or not - if we don't pass our best genes down to our children we are hurting future generations. I suspect the fact that we've turned so against eugenics goes hand in hand with the fact that we've also destroyed the environment, the financial well-being, and even the mental health of the next…
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#26IQ is a shit measure of intelligence
Maybe, maybe not, but how would you know? As of now, IQ is the _only_ measure of intelligence, so there's nothing to compare it against except anecdotes. You can say, "so and so has a low IQ but he seems smart to me", but there's nothing objective to compare it against, so there's really no good way to tell if it does measure that ephemeral quality that we attribute to the term "intelligence". It does track pretty cl…
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
Forgive me, what is a crypto-racist?
Assuming you're asking in good faith: a racist who pretends not to be a racist. They'll often show up asking "Why can't we just have a reasonable discussion about low IQs in the Sub-Saharan African phenotype?" and ready with a Gish gallop list of dubious studies. If this post stays up, I'm sure they'll make an appearance.
Tell me - what is racist about this scientific fact: Black people are stronger and run faster (indubitably due to slavery / selective breeding.) Jews are smarter (most nobel prizes.)
Races are different, sure. To say that smarter or stronger means superior, is racist. But before that, understanding of differences... that's just science.
Since strength and smartness are both held by society as virtues, it's easy to look like a racist if you simply state science.
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#28https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.deseretnews.com/article/695... -Thomas Sowell
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#29I think the bigger debate is whether eugenics or anti-dysgenics should be a policy goal of the government. Whether we like it or not - if we don't pass our best genes down to our children we are hurting future generations. I suspect the fact that we've turned so against eugenics goes hand in hand with the fact that we've also destroyed the environment, the financial well-being, and even the mental health of the next…
We don't know what the best genes are or will be. Furthermore as humans we work together to overcome personal shortcomings and develop technological/medical solutions to overcome genetic "issues". ADHD or ASD can be a gift or a curse depending on the environment you live in. I find different cultures/religions to be quite interesting in their characteristics of families. Mormons seem to have larger families. They req…
True, but we know of a LOT of situations which genes won't be any good. ADHD, ASD are survivable, but despite the fact that one of the great physicists of the 20th century had it, I think even he would agree that ALS should not be allowed to occur.
Also interfering in health effectively means everybody is being asked to bear a burden for those faulty genes. Which is where the real argument will come from.
Re: How Stifling Debate Around Race, Genes and IQ Can Do Harm (2018)
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe, maybe not, but how would you know? As of now, IQ is the _only_ measure of intelligence, so there's nothing to compare it against except anecdotes. You can say, "so and so has a low IQ but he seems smart to me", but there's nothing objective to compare it against, so there's really no good way to tell if it does measure that ephemeral quality that we attribute to the term "intelligence". It does track pretty cl…
Just because something is the only game in town doesn't mean you should use it, that logic doesn't make sense. We need to work on developing better systems rather than saying "oh well, it's the only thing we've got!"
You can characterize and predict how humans will perform in many, many games with this single variable. It's the one that works best. So the current thinking is that there is only one measurement of intelligence. They all converge into a single one. It's called IQ because that was the first one that worked well enough, not because there's just one way to measure it.
(Technically there is also age. Younger people are dumber than older ones up to a pretty high age. But that's the IQ game: age and "raw iq". Nothing else really matters in predicting if someone can succeed at something. IQ, the measure used, is corrected for age, so it should take that out. But a 10 year old with 100 IQ is, in absolute terms, dumber than a 20 year old with IQ 100)
So your criticism is rather a lot beside the point. We have worked, a long and hard and often on developing better systems. We have just never actually succeeded in creating a truly different system (this of course is a "technically incorrect" statement. There are recent research results, there are ... blah blah blah ... there is no halfway decent reason to assume those research directions will lead to anything, but we're still trying. We've been doing that for >100 years, so the odds of the next big thing being in the pipeline right now is small).
The basic observation behind IQ is that "all skills converge" (I would argue this has even been observed in machine learning). If you know one skill, whichever one it is, you become faster, better and quicker to learn almost any other skill. Not much, a little. In machine learning there are papers that point out that the ability to distinguish poodle races in pictures help with music composition. Not "much", but the key is what happens over time. It helps something like 2-5% (measured in time to learn a certain proficiency in music composition). The issue is what happens with kids when you give them new skills regularly over a 10 year period. Then they have 100 more skills, or 100 times 2% easier time to learn a new skill compared to someone who learned nothing. 100 times 2% easier ... is (1.02^100)-1, which is an enormous number (which is why IQ is an exponential score, not a linear one. Someone with 120 should be about double as smart as someone scoring 100. By which we mean that if you take a random intellectual skill, the odds of the person with 120 having some proficiency at that skill is about double that of the person with 100). To add insult to injury IQ compounds on itself. The higher your IQ, the easier it is to get it even higher.
What people hate about IQ is the underlying theory clearly shows that human brains are designed to amplify differences in intelligence over time, not to minimize them. That is a clear and incontestable fact at this point. This is presumably also not a bad thing, or it would have been selected out. This also won't change because of any amount of changes occurring in psychology or the measurement of it. We can prevent ourselves from knowing about it, but we can't change it.