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An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

nytimes.com

21–30 of 133 posts

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#21
post #2

What I struggle to understand is how could esteemed AI researchers like LeCun and many others work for such a company to give it even more powers and edge? How can they justify this as scientists? The huge influx of money into research (here AI, but could be anything in the future) combined with the disfunctions of academia is very troubling.

Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down? That's not my department

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#23
post #2

What I struggle to understand is how could esteemed AI researchers like LeCun and many others work for such a company to give it even more powers and edge? How can they justify this as scientists? The huge influx of money into research (here AI, but could be anything in the future) combined with the disfunctions of academia is very troubling.

Facebook recruiters seem more aggressive lately, perhaps they're starting to actually have trouble attracting top talent?

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#24

I understand this is a manifesto, but really the dialogue around Facebook and social media has truly become unhinged. Facebook is just a symptom, it seems What is there to be _done_? Pandora's box is open, so to speak. If Facebook disappeared overnight, are we really going to assume the problems they're in are going to go away? Everyone is potentially connected to everyone, everywhere, on the entire planet. There has…

There is a solution: all sites (above a scale of say 1m users) must offer a zero advertising, zero tracking account option at a yearly fee of exactly advertising revenue per user per year.

Most people would not take this; but rich people would. The top 1%? Top 5%? This would cripple the monopoly model and open the market.

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#25

Its curious that the media is going to such great lengths to paint Facebook as villians. My own Facebook stream is travel photos, people saying gushy things about their spouse, plus a few people still obsessed with Trump. Harmless stuff. Our lives must be pretty cushy when this is one of the biggest dangers that we face.

Also what's not there? What are you not seeing? Have you wondered about the world outside your bubble?

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#26
post #2

What I struggle to understand is how could esteemed AI researchers like LeCun and many others work for such a company to give it even more powers and edge? How can they justify this as scientists? The huge influx of money into research (here AI, but could be anything in the future) combined with the disfunctions of academia is very troubling.

We need an Operation Paperclip for Facebook talent.

Well we eventually got two things out of that operation....ICBM's and the Saturn V.

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#27

I understand this is a manifesto, but really the dialogue around Facebook and social media has truly become unhinged. Facebook is just a symptom, it seems What is there to be _done_? Pandora's box is open, so to speak. If Facebook disappeared overnight, are we really going to assume the problems they're in are going to go away? Everyone is potentially connected to everyone, everywhere, on the entire planet. There has…

The minds that were behind LiveJournal, Friendster, and MySpace, to name just 3 other social platforms that had monthly active usership in the millions, were not as disgustingly criminal and unethical in nature as the mind of Zuckerberg, so, to answer your question, another online social platform could be more civil and nicer, and not as aggressive (with auto-playing, auto-looped videos, for one thing), and manipulative, and silo-creating in terms of the design and algorithms in the same way, and could be far less ruthlessly greedy, invasive, and devious toward its users in terms of the requiring, gathering, selling, and sharing of those users' data.

An online social networking platform could even take a total different format than one that invites users to upload all their real personal life information and photos; there could be a platform as one where the users are playing ficitonalized characters in a make-believe world, and there isn't the same severe data-mining and harvesting of users' minds and lives, let alone with clear algorithmic and editorial favoring of political-themed content; I'm thinking first of something like the The Sims from 2000 to 2015[0], but there is a now a certain game that has become the de-facto social network of pre-teens to early teens, and that is Fortnite Battle Royale - see these 2 articles from December 2018[1]-[5]. Yes, there are other risks and dangers with such a platform (where gamification is taken to a much further extent: you're playing much more of a character in a game than you are with the "character" you "play"--in the sense of "portray" and "direct" on Facebook)[6], but it's not, in my view, nearly as immoral and irresponsible as what Facebook does.

[0] Sims popularity, as recently as 2014, when the latest version of it was still the #1 computer game:

https://simscommunity.info/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Screen...

[1] Charged: Fortnite isn't a game, it's a place - As social media becomes ever more toxic, Fortnite has become the new social network and a place to hang out where you go to talk to friends

https://char.gd/blog/2018/fortnite-is-the-new-hangout-spot

[2] WSJ: How Fortnite Triggered an Unwinnable War Between Parents and Their Boys

http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-fortnite-triggered-an-unwinn...

[3] See the selected tweets here, including: "Fortnite is the tween generation's Facebook (at least for boys). Spent a few hours last weekend with a friend's 12 YO, Fortnite is the platform for his entire social/academic life. FYI i was labeled an 'old noobie'."

https://www.techmeme.com/181222/p8#a181222p8

[4] The astonishing usership stats (scroll down to the list):

http://www.businessofapps.com/data/fortnite-statistics/

[5] Many more stats:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortnite_Battle_Royale#Player_...

[6] Impact:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortnite_Battle_Royale#Impact

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#28
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Science should be above this. Inspired by your comment, I'll make my point more graphically: Nazi camps were also suitable for medical and spychological testing. Nazi and even interned doctors did all sorts of experiments on prisoners. And if they refused to do so, pretty sure other people would have been happy to replace. Not everyone shared the same concerns regarding human life.

They were able to do a lot of beneficial research because they didn’t have to deal with cumbersome regulations and roadblocks. And if they didn’t do it, someone else would have lined up to take advantage of the opportunities. Edit: If it isn’t clear, I am being sarcastic.

It depends how you see things. imho some things are intrinsically wrong, doing them because "someone else would have lined up to take advantage of the opportunities" doesn't change the fact that it's wrong in the first place.

Just the same way that if something wrong is done by a lot of people it doesn't make it right (smoking, drinking &c.).

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#29
This debate is needlessly muddled by this fuzzy notion that because it is "the Internet" therefore something different needs to be done, that this is somehow a new situation. But it is not. If it was the 1970s and people were told to sign a contract to allow a company to physically track every single event in their lives, they would not consent to it. If it was the 1970s and some company tried to get exclusive access to people's TV and radio to bombard them with bespoke advertisement and propaganda, they would not consent to it. So then what is so different? Nothing much. What Facebook and Google and others are currently doing is way beyond what a sane society would allow. It is just that people are confused because it is done through a new medium, but nothing much is different.

Re: An Anti-Facebook Manifesto, by an Early Facebook Investor

#30

I understand this is a manifesto, but really the dialogue around Facebook and social media has truly become unhinged. Facebook is just a symptom, it seems What is there to be _done_? Pandora's box is open, so to speak. If Facebook disappeared overnight, are we really going to assume the problems they're in are going to go away? Everyone is potentially connected to everyone, everywhere, on the entire planet. There has…

"What is there to be done?"

A $0.01 tax per ad impression.

Such a thing would not destroy the advertising industry, but it would do wonders for making it much less worthwhile to deploy massive surveillance technology to make .03 cents more per user per day, and leave only very high-value advertising behind. It would probably anti-decimate it or more, though (leave only 10% behind instead of destroying 10%).

$0.10 per impression if you're feeling feisty.

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