Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future • Hacker News Board

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#21

Post by runT1ME » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:47 AM UTC

jojopotato wrote: post #14

runT1ME wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A government mandated Ponzi scheme. Brilliant. :(

I don't quite get why people keep calling Social Security a ponzi scheme. A ponzi scheme is defrauding investors by saying that there has been growth in the assets and it's paying out dividends, SS doesn't make any claim like that. The real problem people are complaining about is the burden that was shared by many (by having lots of kids) is going to be shared by fewer and fewer people.

Social Security's dividends are paid for by the new investors buying in, and THOSE investors will only be paid out if even more investors enter the scheme.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#22

Post by shawndrost » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:48 AM UTC

jojopotato wrote: post #14

runT1ME wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A government mandated Ponzi scheme. Brilliant. :(

I don't quite get why people keep calling Social Security a ponzi scheme. A ponzi scheme is defrauding investors by saying that there has been growth in the assets and it's paying out dividends, SS doesn't make any claim like that. The real problem people are complaining about is the burden that was shared by many (by having lots of kids) is going to be shared by fewer and fewer people.

Wait a second -- to be strictly accurate, Social Security does explicitly state those two things.

WRT "growth in assets": they send out letters to all enrollees stating the amount of money that each has coming to them. and the number is higher than the amount the enrollee has paid in (to reflect the interest that "will accumulate").

WRT "paying out dividends": the system is paying out dividends, obviously. I know some of the people getting checks. Not sure what you meant by this.

I think it's a bit misleading to call Social Security a ponzi scheme -- mostly because it implies a ringleader, which I observe to be a dangerously appealing falsehood to many -- but your observations seem to be false.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#23

Post by brc » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:52 AM UTC

sbov wrote: post #7

I thought that this applied to those 40 and under.

yes, me too. There seems to be an entire generation of people missing from this thought bubble. It's not going pass from a bunch of 50 and 60 year olds straight to 25 year olds without skipping the ones in the middle. The ones that worked through the 90's recessions and probably remember the '80s recessions as well.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#24

Post by Yzupnick » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:54 AM UTC

jojopotato wrote: post #14

runT1ME wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A government mandated Ponzi scheme. Brilliant. :(

I don't quite get why people keep calling Social Security a ponzi scheme. A ponzi scheme is defrauding investors by saying that there has been growth in the assets and it's paying out dividends, SS doesn't make any claim like that. The real problem people are complaining about is the burden that was shared by many (by having lots of kids) is going to be shared by fewer and fewer people.

I think people mean pyramid scheme.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#25

Post by aquateen » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:54 AM UTC

SlyShy wrote: post #3

As an 18 year old reading this sort of writing makes me want to leave the country. Except that I'd be taxed for ten years after expatriating, and there isn't any country that I know of as being similarly entrepreneurial. If anyone has suggestions, though, I would love to hear them.

I'm pretty sure you don't get double-taxed on your first x dollars, where x is 80k or more if I recall.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#26

Post by jsz0 » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 6:57 AM UTC

ianisborn wrote: post #4

Being a 22 year old myself, I'm grateful that nothing in here is surprising to me and that my parents made me start a savings account when I was young (like 10 or something). To be honest, I don't think I've met anyone from my generation who expects to see money from social security when they retire.

Social Security is good till 2040 at minimum. Some modest adjustments can extend it even further and more radical changes gets it to the 22nd century. All of this is possible without even touching the ~50% of the budget that goes towards military spending or raising payroll taxes significantly. My personal opinion is we shouldn't even consider cutting a single social safety net until military spending has been slashed. Even China is now limiting the growth of military spending yet in the US this topic is totally off the table.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#27

Post by hop » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 7:02 AM UTC

Son, There is massive opportunity out there waiting for you to seize. Be thankful you were born in America and have the opportunity of free enterprise. Our country has a lot of debt and there will be inflation ahead, and taxes will likely be higher too, but they will be higher for everyone else so don't sweat it - wealth is relative.

Be frugal, marry wise and start a business. Take risks now while you are young. The future is bright.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#28

Post by dustyreagan » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 7:12 AM UTC

SlyShy wrote: post #3

As an 18 year old reading this sort of writing makes me want to leave the country. Except that I'd be taxed for ten years after expatriating, and there isn't any country that I know of as being similarly entrepreneurial. If anyone has suggestions, though, I would love to hear them.

Alternatively you could take some initiative and help make your current community and ultimately your country better.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#29

Post by philwelch » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 7:16 AM UTC

gamble wrote: post #18

Right now, in the wake of the most significant financial crisis in decades and with the country staring down enormous structural deficits, the most contentious issue is whether it's fair to let tax cuts expire for people making more than $250k/year. America isn't remotely close to a serious debate. The problem with articles like this is that they assume the country is still capable of negotiating changes that would r…

* Look at Obama's health care bill. I hope you like it, because no one is going to touch healthcare again in our generation.*

Well, no one's going to take on the mantle of vast reform anytime soon, but there isn't an administration in recent history that hasn't tweaked health care a bit one way or the other.

Re: Dear 22 Year Old: Concerning your economic Future

#30

Post by sliverstorm » Wed, Oct 13, 2010, 7:17 AM UTC

ianisborn wrote: post #4

Being a 22 year old myself, I'm grateful that nothing in here is surprising to me and that my parents made me start a savings account when I was young (like 10 or something). To be honest, I don't think I've met anyone from my generation who expects to see money from social security when they retire.

> To be honest, I don't think I've met anyone from my generation who expects to see money from social security when they retire.

Me neither, and I'm 22 as well. So long as we're not just being manipulated, I think it's probably a good thing. Hopefully it will make us more independent and self-sufficient in the long run.