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Consider applying for grad school

80000hours.org

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Re: Consider applying for grad school

#21

Post by ianai »

chrisseaton wrote: post #20
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the whole article, including the "why not to get a PhD part." I still thought it was way too kind to the "get a PhD" side of the equation. PhDs represent a tremendous opportunity cost, and I have not seen good evidence that they causally improve outcomes in the vast majority of cases.

How are you measuring outcomes? Just salary? Because how would you empirically measure anything else?

Salary, salary regressed on all factors of things (age,sex,years in industry, etc). Once the equation is properly balanced the marginal impact of a PhD is less than the marginal impact of just those added years in the field.

And don’t forget to factor in the opportunity cost of accruing student loan debt (which can’t be defaulted!) against lost yearly income.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#22

Post by BadassFractal »

shoo wrote: post #15
s0rce wrote: post #11

Huge opportunity cost for 5-8 years, think carefully. Also, very very few jobs in academia so don't plan on those. Was interesting and learned a lot, not sure the most useful use of those years.

indeed. a few folks in the FIRE (financial independence / retire early) space talk about being able to save enough money to be retired or semi-retired from 7-8 years of full-time work (this doesn't require FAANG scale salaries, just a combination of working somewhere that pays pretty well, not spending much money, building up investments, and luck to avoid getting clobbered with huge medical expenses. and the luck to…

Interesting, where does one learn more about that?

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#24

Post by chrisseaton »

ianai wrote: post #21
chrisseaton wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are you measuring outcomes? Just salary? Because how would you empirically measure anything else?

Salary, salary regressed on all factors of things (age,sex,years in industry, etc). Once the equation is properly balanced the marginal impact of a PhD is less than the marginal impact of just those added years in the field. And don’t forget to factor in the opportunity cost of accruing student loan debt (which can’t be defaulted!) against lost yearly income.

Right, but there are outcomes beside salary aren't there?

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#25

Post by privateSFacct »

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #9
3minus1 wrote: post #5

I was expecting reasons why now is a better climate to apply then in previous years. That would be interesting, but instead it's a list of generic reasons to apply for a phd. Yes, I know that phd's can open doors.

I read the whole article, including the "why not to get a PhD part." I still thought it was way too kind to the "get a PhD" side of the equation. PhDs represent a tremendous opportunity cost, and I have not seen good evidence that they causally improve outcomes in the vast majority of cases.

The opportunity cost is a LIFE cost.

Friends getting phd's - poorer, later start in life to almost everything (family, house etc) and the job market is not great.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#27

Post by cmpolis »

BadassFractal wrote: post #22
shoo wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

indeed. a few folks in the FIRE (financial independence / retire early) space talk about being able to save enough money to be retired or semi-retired from 7-8 years of full-time work (this doesn't require FAANG scale salaries, just a combination of working somewhere that pays pretty well, not spending much money, building up investments, and luck to avoid getting clobbered with huge medical expenses. and the luck to…

Interesting, where does one learn more about that?

http://reddit.com/r/financialindependence

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#28

Post by Eridrus »

I think the context that most commenters are missing here is that this is not an argument that you will make more money with a PhD.

The focus of 80,000 hours is on "effective altruism" where the goal is to have the greatest positive impact on the world.

And it's not super hard to believe that there are quite a few jobs that require a PhD, often due to plain credentialism, that have significantly more impact than your average software developer at a well paying company.

I'm still not going to do a PhD, but I'm really not the target audience here, and it's sort of not surprising since 80,000 hours is an outgrowth of academia itself.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#29

Post by mmirate »

chrisseaton wrote: post #24
ianai wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Salary, salary regressed on all factors of things (age,sex,years in industry, etc). Once the equation is properly balanced the marginal impact of a PhD is less than the marginal impact of just those added years in the field. And don’t forget to factor in the opportunity cost of accruing student loan debt (which can’t be defaulted!) against lost yearly income.

Right, but there are outcomes beside salary aren't there?

Pedantically: yes, but almost all of them have salary as a prerequisite.

Practically: no, not really.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#30

Post by pazimzadeh »

I can't wait until you can make new strains of E. coli on your desktop/iPad. Time in grad school is often spent cloning. It would be really great if there were more community-accessible Core facilities available on a subscription service.
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