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OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

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Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#21

Post by sambroner »

jsheard wrote: post #3

For context: OpenAI is playing against a professional team this time, unlike the event a few weeks ago where the humans were skilled but not active pros or used to playing together. This team isn't the strongest (they placed 17-18th during this TI) but OpenAI will play again tomorrow and the day after, presumably against progressively better teams.

Seems like playing one of the best 200 players in the world is a reasonable proxy for a top tier player.

I'm unfamiliar with DOTA rules, but does anyone know if there are any limitations on the openAI team? e.g. Things like keystrokes per minute, scroll speed, etc

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#22

Post by jsheard »

sambroner wrote: post #21
jsheard wrote: post #3

For context: OpenAI is playing against a professional team this time, unlike the event a few weeks ago where the humans were skilled but not active pros or used to playing together. This team isn't the strongest (they placed 17-18th during this TI) but OpenAI will play again tomorrow and the day after, presumably against progressively better teams.

Seems like playing one of the best 200 players in the world is a reasonable proxy for a top tier player. I'm unfamiliar with DOTA rules, but does anyone know if there are any limitations on the openAI team? e.g. Things like keystrokes per minute, scroll speed, etc

During the last OpenAI showmatch the bots had an artificial 200ms reaction time imposed on them, I assume it's the same here but I'm not sure.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#23

Post by sambroner »

jsheard wrote: post #22
sambroner wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like playing one of the best 200 players in the world is a reasonable proxy for a top tier player. I'm unfamiliar with DOTA rules, but does anyone know if there are any limitations on the openAI team? e.g. Things like keystrokes per minute, scroll speed, etc

During the last OpenAI showmatch the bots had an artificial 200ms reaction time imposed on them, I assume it's the same here but I'm not sure.

Thanks.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#24

Post by nopinsight »

jsheard wrote: post #3

For context: OpenAI is playing against a professional team this time, unlike the event a few weeks ago where the humans were skilled but not active pros or used to playing together. This team isn't the strongest (they placed 17-18th during this TI) but OpenAI will play again tomorrow and the day after, presumably against progressively better teams.

In general, the differences among a top echelon of human expertise are vastly smaller than those between humans and other kinds of agents, animals or AIs. We all share similar cognitive architecture for handling complex domains after all.

Once OpenAI Five defeat 3-4 pro teams convincingly, it could be presumed from the observation above that they will defeat any other top teams within a year at most, if sufficient resources are used for improving the AI. An exception is when a fundamental hidden weakness is found in the AI.

Another confounding factor is major rule changes where the game essentially becomes a different one.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#25

Post by el_devo »

sambroner wrote: post #21
jsheard wrote: post #3

For context: OpenAI is playing against a professional team this time, unlike the event a few weeks ago where the humans were skilled but not active pros or used to playing together. This team isn't the strongest (they placed 17-18th during this TI) but OpenAI will play again tomorrow and the day after, presumably against progressively better teams.

Seems like playing one of the best 200 players in the world is a reasonable proxy for a top tier player. I'm unfamiliar with DOTA rules, but does anyone know if there are any limitations on the openAI team? e.g. Things like keystrokes per minute, scroll speed, etc

Yes, as the sibling poster said, there is a 200ms reaction speed restriction on OpenAI. Also note that OpenAI is using the Dota 2 bot API (its input is not pixels, and its outputs are not mouse actions and keystrokes), so it has more precise information than the human team on things like unit coordinates and can target its actions more exactly.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#27

Post by balls187 »

bxio wrote: post #8

This time, OpenAI is playing a normal game without restrictions. Team Human got thoroughly trashed last time vs OpenAI in a game with hero restrictions. Go OpenAI! I For One welcome our new robot overlords.

Dropped the first game. Pretty funny that the last openAI bot attempted to feed mid.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#28

Post by jjcm »

Overall a very good game. Definitely smart on PAIN gaming's part to delay the game and wait until the mid game (where OpenAI traditionally excels the most) is over in order to rely on their stronger carry. I think the lack of 5 couriers really showed where OpenAI had a crutch the last game it played. Excited to see the improvements as this goes on, and I suspect that next year we'll see the OpenAI team beat the #1 ranked human team.

Re: OpenAI Five at Dota 2 – The International [video]

#30

Post by larkeith »

jsheard wrote: post #22
sambroner wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like playing one of the best 200 players in the world is a reasonable proxy for a top tier player. I'm unfamiliar with DOTA rules, but does anyone know if there are any limitations on the openAI team? e.g. Things like keystrokes per minute, scroll speed, etc

During the last OpenAI showmatch the bots had an artificial 200ms reaction time imposed on them, I assume it's the same here but I'm not sure.

I don't believe this is the case, as OpenAI was able to hex (an immediate disable) Earthshaker before he got off Echoslam (a spell with no cast delay except the time to click the key).
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