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How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

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Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#21

Post by mattlondon »

ihaveajob wrote: post #20
mattlondon wrote: post #17

Its the availability that is the killer for these sorts of services, as one of the people interviewed in the article says. I don't see how these services can compare with a private car without totally saturating the neighborhood with lots of idle vehicles sitting around to cover the spikes in demand without suffering infuriating unavailability when you need to get somewhere. Its already annoying seeing all the dock-l…

On the flip side, consider the time you spend looking for parking. Depending on where you live, that's also a big time sink. I'd rather be checking Twitter on the sidewalk than cursing the parking gods looping around, but that's just me.

Yeah that is true - it can be useful in those situations where they can just drop you off (often - at least in the UK - where parking is bad, public transport is usually fairly functional though so that is an option too - that said it also helps to fill in gaps in the public transport - e.g. instead of going from A->B then B->C on a train, you can just go direct A->C etc)

Of course, a car-sharing application also suffers from the parking issue though.

Personally for me I use my cars most where parking is not a problem (e.g. driving to friends & family, to the shops, vacations etc). I fail to see how ride-hailing is going to make this sort of use of a car obsolete.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#22

Post by Tepix »

From TFA:

> The cost of cars accounts for as much as 85 percent of personal transportation spending, according to Hietanen, even though the average car is used only 4 percent of the time.

Sounds like a great opportunity indeed. Former car owners save money and the car rental companies can still make a profit. Everyone (including the environment) wins.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#23

Post by nmeofthestate »

"The cost of cars accounts for as much as 85 percent of personal transportation spending, according to Hietanen, even though the average car is used only 4 percent of the time."

This figure is a bit silly - you don't drive your car while you're sleeping, or indeed when you're already where you want to be. Doesn't mean it's not a useful thing to own.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#25

Post by swebs »

Jommi wrote: post #14
illuminati1911 wrote: post #12

It’s amazing how this slimy advertisement hasn’t been flagged already. I’m a former Helsinki resident at this is just overhyped bs ad for another startup.

Yeah it's abit of a fluff piece, but compared to stuff that comes out in the US scene everyday it's nothing. Can't we just once be positive? The app works, there are no lies in the article. Maybe if people in Finland were a bit more optimistic there would be more successful companies

The article could make it more clear that this is the work of a private startup, and not a public service as the title implies.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#26

Post by icebraining »

mattlondon wrote: post #21
ihaveajob wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the flip side, consider the time you spend looking for parking. Depending on where you live, that's also a big time sink. I'd rather be checking Twitter on the sidewalk than cursing the parking gods looping around, but that's just me.

Yeah that is true - it can be useful in those situations where they can just drop you off (often - at least in the UK - where parking is bad, public transport is usually fairly functional though so that is an option too - that said it also helps to fill in gaps in the public transport - e.g. instead of going from A->B then B->C on a train, you can just go direct A->C etc) Of course, a car-sharing application also suf…

that said it also helps to fill in gaps in the public transport

But that's exactly it - when 95% of your transportation needs are better solved by a tapestry of buses, trains, boats, bicycles, delivery services, etc, keeping a car just for those 5% becomes an expensive and often inconvenient luxury. It's like buying an apartment in every place you visit, rather than using an hotel or equivalent. I don't think ride-hailing/taxis will ever become a default, but it's an important part of the whole system.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#27

Post by swebs »

icebraining wrote: post #5

Can Whim do trip planning using all transportation options? Having a few apps doesn't bother me, what I'm missing is something that says "hail a car to the train station A, then take a train to station B and then a bicycle to point C".

Google Maps and the official HSL (Helsinki public transit) app seem to offer what you're looking for.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#28

Post by yurishimo »

The 499 euro price tag for the "all access" seems quite expensive from an American point of view. I can get a decent car with good gas mileage for about half that and outright buying a used car will save me a lot more in less than a year. Most people who would be tempted to go without owning a car in the US don't do much driving anyway, so they don't spend a lot on gas as is.

While I think this could work in NYC, Seattle, or San Francisco, most other American cities have plenty of infrastructure and affordable parking to support a high percentage of car ownership amongst citizens.

Heck, there was even a HN article a day or two ago about how parking spaces in America outnumber actual cars by a huge margin in most American cities and towns. I think in one city it was 80 to 1.

Unfortunately, the US is still too spread out for these types of services to be useful in all but a few cities.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#29

Post by lambdadmitry »

yurishimo wrote: post #28

The 499 euro price tag for the "all access" seems quite expensive from an American point of view. I can get a decent car with good gas mileage for about half that and outright buying a used car will save me a lot more in less than a year. Most people who would be tempted to go without owning a car in the US don't do much driving anyway, so they don't spend a lot on gas as is. While I think this could work in NYC, Sea…

> I can get a decent car with good gas mileage for about half that

That implies public transport inferiority compared to owning a car. It's not the case for a lot of European cities.

Re: How Helsinki Arrived at the Future of Urban Travel First

#30

Post by outime »

jpatokal wrote: post #24

As a former Helsinkian, I'm rather surprised to see the label "future of urban travel" applied to a city that has banned all forms of Uber-style ride-sharing due to pressure from the taxi lobby.

I believe they banned it because they ignored the local laws (and Helsinki isn’t exactly an isolated case of this behaviour from Uber) and were unlicensed.

However they’ve recently regained presence in Helsinki since it’s been legalized [1].

[1] https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/anyone_can_be_a_cabbie__n...

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