> Sun, 23 Apr 2006
I think it matters since languages like clojure are everywhere, including at Google.
How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
21–30 of 433 posts
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#22Using any language for twenty years straight is going to make you complacent - but goodness, how many languages would have given you that luxury?
The APL / J / K family of languages seems to be very strong with this effect. If it fits your problem domain, it's (apparently) so powerful that using anything else feels like a frustrating waste of time.
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#23> knowing Lisp made me all too keenly aware of Java's shortcomings, and I had a very hard time not being angry at how stupid it was that I was being forced to use it. I would take this as a the thing to remember from this. When you are too angry at something, you cant learn it. I have seen the emotional refusal to learn new inferior thing (or read comments that amounted to the same) many times already. It is somethin…
Yes, I agree. It's a problem much wider than just programming languages, it's an emotional issue in general. As a person who does Lisp out of enjoyment and Java/Erlang/bash for a living, it was good for me to get over the attitude of "my language is superior" and actually open up and learn a thing or two from these "inferior" languages, both when it comes to things that are worth repeating and not worth repeating.
If anything, remember that Lisp, Java, Brainfuck and hundreds of other langs are all Turing-complete and therefore equivalent to one another when it comes to computability.
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#24All of it probably to be taken with a grain of salt.
any particular reason?
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#25This is from 2006 though.
Since then functional programming has picked up a lot of steam again, and I'm pretty sure having been a lisper for 30 years gets you good jobs. If not in Lisp, haskell, F#, clojure or whatever...
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#26> knowing Lisp made me all too keenly aware of Java's shortcomings, and I had a very hard time not being angry at how stupid it was that I was being forced to use it. I would take this as a the thing to remember from this. When you are too angry at something, you cant learn it. I have seen the emotional refusal to learn new inferior thing (or read comments that amounted to the same) many times already. It is somethin…
I'm interested in knowing your secret to finding inferior new things interesting.
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#27I think the problem there was complacency, as the author mention in their mail. On the other hand, I totally do recommend that everyone picks up some tutorial or guide or book on LISP and learns what the fuzz is all about. Even today, I feel like a lot of people could learn a lot from LISP and S-Expressions, both of which are powerful constructs. (Note: I'm not saying you should use LISP productively, it's something…
> (Note: I'm not saying you should use LISP productively, it's something you should learn for the heck of it, not to actually use it)
Well, I do, and I have to say that it can be done. It isn't a road often travelled and it results in people making remarks about your language choices, but as long as my software works, its development is fun for me and my co-coders do not complain, I don't think anything is wrong with my setup. :)
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
Perl?
Perl is one of those languages, if you get used to the power of Perl it could be really hard to move to other C based languages. I can only imagine how it would be for anyone using Lisp. The power there is so much, going to something like Java from there would feel down right suffocating. Going from Perl to Python in my case largely felt like trying to a run a marathon in chains.
I share your experience. Python took all the fun out of computing for me.
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#29The conclusion was inescapable: the problem wasn't Perl or C++ or Java, it was me. I just wasn't a very good programmer any more. Lisp's power had made me complacent, and the world had passed me by. Lisp can't help you if you're too smug for your own good. Disclaimer: I'm a Lisper.
Easy now, pretty sure the author is not advocating that mindset.
Re: How knowing Lisp destroyed my programming career (2006)
#30A required thought-piece for all JavaScript devs. Enjoy monopoly while it lasts, but be humble.
Fortunately JavaScript doesn't have the problem described by the OP:
"With a secret weapon like Lisp in my arsenal in 1986 I could blow my competition out of the water with one hand tied behind my back and holding a martini in the other."
A present-day JavaScript practitioner will have his left hand busy trying to figure out what's this week's fashionable way to pass around some data in this month's fashionable framework and his right hand busy trying to make npm and Webpack work, leaving no time for martinis or blowing anyone out of the water.