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Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

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Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You cite a single article, which goes against the past two decades of experience, where illegal downloads have decimated much of the entire music industry.

lmao, you sure know what you're talking about, the music industry is just in tatters these days huh

Have you compared it today with what it was circa 1995? Yes, it is in tatters.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#22
post #4

I'm not surprised when I see on swedish news how a pedophile gets 3-4 years for molesting hundreds of children and a bank robber gets 5-8 years for not hurting a single person but stealing millions. It's a long standing dark gag here that financial crime is being treated much worse than violent crime.

Bank robbery is a bad example of a financial crime..

But embezzlement, etc... Are often punished harder because these are deliberate crimes, often thought-out by rational people. And these crimes are done by people to who a great responsibility was entrusted.

Most violent crimes, most crimes in fact, are not even remotely thought through. They are extremely impulsive, or unlike to be financially motivated.

Finally, crimes like corruption and embezzlement constitutes serious threats to society. Because they erodes peoples trust in institutions, rule of law, police, etc.

Americans would trust wall street more if there was fewer financial crimes..

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#23
As a swede, I am unfortunately not surprised. While we have a surge in violent crimes mainly due to mass immigration this kind of shit gets pushed.

When I was young, explosions and gang criminality were extremely rare and uncommon but today it is unfortunately being more common. I have several friends, including me, that has been the victim of either threats or violence in the recent years but the perpetrators always walks free due to our incompetent police and justice system that doesn't even investigate even the most obvious crimes where the perpetrator is known.

Some examples:

- My uncle was beaten down and had to be in the hospital for tring to stop 3 people from stealing a bike. No further investigation.

- I am/was being threatned several times by a guy, which I reported to the police several times and they haven't even started to look at my case yet (this was several months ago). I am very certain that the preliminary investigation will be canceled.

- Several sexual crimes towards children isn't even being investigated due to "heavy work burden" [1]

The development is really pissing me off and I am even thinking about moving from Sweden since I often times don't feel secure anymore. If this bill gets through it is simply more proof how insane our politicians are. They don't give any reason to believe that they even care the slightest about civilians security, just the image of the country as a whole. This kind of legislation will be used in the same way the drug policies are used, they increase the statistics for the police to make it look like they solve a bunch of crimes when in reality they do not solve most crimes of importance.

[1]: https://translate.google.se/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&js=y&prev=...

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

lmao, you sure know what you're talking about, the music industry is just in tatters these days huh

Have you compared it today with what it was circa 1995? Yes, it is in tatters.

look, i get that you've gotten yourself into a career where you're adjacent to the legal system so you have no ability to critically evaluate anything beyond "it is/isn't legal therefore it is/isn't good" but if you try talking to a young person you might realize the number of independent artists has been exploding every year for a decade and we now have more people creating quality music than ever before in the history of the world (more people per capita than ever before as well, I'd wager). the ability to share and expose others to these new artists faster and easier than ever before is what makes this possible. sorry that no one cares that the big record labels and top 40s that made all their money on CDs are losing ground to distribution methods that aren't utterly unable to adapt to the industry's current landscape

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#25
post #10
post #4

I'm not surprised when I see on swedish news how a pedophile gets 3-4 years for molesting hundreds of children and a bank robber gets 5-8 years for not hurting a single person but stealing millions. It's a long standing dark gag here that financial crime is being treated much worse than violent crime.

Not sure where you are going with this. Shorter times for financial crime? Why? And what does any of this have to do with file sharing?

I guess the argument is that piracy is a financial crime. Which at a certainly scale is absolutely true.

Sweden have historically had very weak laws when it comes to private citizens doing piracy. But that's also very different from a commercial piracy enterprise.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#26
post #18

I don't know Swedish law, but I will guess that like American law, any parliament/house member can introduce basically any bill saying anything. Presumably the bill will not pass if it's terrible and the other members are sane/not-corrupt. So the presence of this bill is unfortunate, but I doubt it would get passed. The money in politics problem has been increasing in much of the development world, so we have seen co…

> I don't know Swedish law, but I will guess that like American law, any parliament/house member can introduce basically any bill saying anything.

So this "bill" is the result of an investigation started by the government. The investigation concludes (document posted by me elsewhere in this thread (in Swedish)) that it would be appropriate to change the law, and what the "bill" should look like.

Have not found the stage of the bill yet, the suggestion for a bill in the final document of the investigation is what I found so far.

The investigation appears to have been performed by people from various instances; governmental, academic, and industry. Only one person from industry; "Film och TV-branschens Samarbetskommitté", whose role was "sakkunnig"/subject expert.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#27
post #4

I'm not surprised when I see on swedish news how a pedophile gets 3-4 years for molesting hundreds of children and a bank robber gets 5-8 years for not hurting a single person but stealing millions. It's a long standing dark gag here that financial crime is being treated much worse than violent crime.

You won't get 5-8 years for stealing money. But many bank robberies kill or severely hurt people. And even where they don't, victims can be traumatised for a long time. Having a gun pointed at you isn't great for your mental health.

Harsh sentences for those cases are not about the money lost by an insurance, it's about the willingness to hurt or kill people for some extra money.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#28

As a swede, I am unfortunately not surprised. While we have a surge in violent crimes mainly due to mass immigration this kind of shit gets pushed. When I was young, explosions and gang criminality were extremely rare and uncommon but today it is unfortunately being more common. I have several friends, including me, that has been the victim of either threats or violence in the recent years but the perpetrators always…

> When I was young, explosions and gang criminality were extremely rare and uncommon

Are you sure about this? Crime has decreased significantly over the past decades in most countries. I also can't remember any crime from when I was young but my area was much more dangerous back then. But as a child, you don't notice subtle signs of crime and won't get beaten up because you try to prevent people from stealing a bike. And even if that happens to a family member I'm not sure parents tell their children the truth. But asking your parents won't help, memory is always biased, my memory of the area I lived in as a student is also much better than it deserved.

More communication by social media has probably also played a role, it's much easier to track crimes nowadays. But even where crimes were reported back then it's really hard to compare that unless you use official statistics.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#29

This is frankly surprising to me. Didn’t the Pirate Party win seats in the Swedish parliament? What happened to them?

They won seats in the EU parliament, but didn't manage to enter the national parliament.

Since then their main issue has mostly died, the law allowing FRA to spy on all our outgoing communications passed and the pirate bay people where taken down. But there's not been much action about these issues since then, and as a protest party option they are completely eclipsed by the racists.

Re: Crazy new Swedish bill makes sharing music and TV as bad a “crime” as manslaughter

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Do you understand what I'm saying?" shouted Moist. "You can't just go around killing people!" "Why Not? You Do." The golem lowered his arm. "What?" snapped Moist. "I do not! Who told you that?" "I Worked It Out. You Have Killed Two Point Three Three Eight People," said the golem calmly. "I have never laid a finger on anyone in my life, Mr Pump. I may be–– all the things you know I am, but I am not a killer! I have n…

It's far more nefarious to steal $1.00 from a million people than $1M from one.

Stealing $1.00 from a million people who won't miss it is more devious as you're less likely to get caught and if you get caught people are less likely to bother pursuing it.

But I think it is impossible to say one is objectively worse than the other. It depends so much on how the crime affects people. If you steal a million from a multi-billionaire, he might not even notice. If you scam a clueless person out of a million that they got in debt to hand over to you, that will ruin their life.

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