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An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

nytimes.com

21–30 of 51 posts

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#21
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the situation is complete opposite. Code is formal, deterministically executable rules. That's a boon for the rule of law, as the vast majority of "crimes" can be prevented a priori , rather than chased down post facto. Even C++ is miles ahead of the "legalese" that forms traditional laws. Being executable by the common person, it avoids one glaring violation of equal protection that modern legalese limps a…

> The real problem driving this article is the legacy ambient authorities wanting to expand their role, insisting that the informal intentions behind the design of (and decision to run) the code should carry more weight than the code itself! Just because I accidentally left my door unlocked today doesn't mean that entering my house, and taking all my stuff isn't burglary. You don't have to be a telepath to know that…

> Society only functions because we respect the informal intentions of other people.

I agree wholeheartedly, in the local scale person-to-person sense.

But your argument is knocking down a straw man, by coming at it from the other direction. I'm not advocating for being an asshole via finding loopholes, but against the ridiculousness of creating a second set of half-formal rules to repair deficiencies in the fully formal ones.

> Under the 'code is law' doctrine, just because you could do something, you can do something. This is incompatible with anything resembling civilized society.

Yet this is exactly how the legal system does work. If an action is "wrong" but not illegal you can't actually be sanctioned for it. See: pretty much any large company in the news over some kind of outrage that will ultimately go unpunished.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#22

For entire classes of online crime, from a purely data perspective I wonder if providing a way to anonymously report a crime would help? Things like extortion, cheating spouses, lewd photos, revenge porn tend to be quite embarrassing, and perhaps pursuing justice isn't worth getting exposed. But knowing names, emails, patterns, and other details might help at least paint a better picture of the true nature of online…

Sounds like a channel that would be instantly DDOSed for a number of reasons. Criminals would want it down, and the usual people with issues around law enforcement would want to hurt it, while younger people would potentially do it for shits and giggles.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#23
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real problem driving this article is the legacy ambient authorities wanting to expand their role, insisting that the informal intentions behind the design of (and decision to run) the code should carry more weight than the code itself! Just because I accidentally left my door unlocked today doesn't mean that entering my house, and taking all my stuff isn't burglary. You don't have to be a telepath to know that…

> Society only functions because we respect the informal intentions of other people. I agree wholeheartedly, in the local scale person-to-person sense. But your argument is knocking down a straw man, by coming at it from the other direction. I'm not advocating for being an asshole via finding loopholes, but against the ridiculousness of creating a second set of half-formal rules to repair deficiencies in the fully fo…

Law is interpreted by the courts, which creates jurisprudence. The letter of the law is subject to the interpretation of the courts to a very great extent.

Edit: I misread the comment I responded to, and as the poster rightly pointed out, my comment is just stating the obvious. Sorry about that.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#24
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would be nice if cloud providers automatically had a fence around your subnet with an ssh proxy that did this stuff already. Seems crazy that typically you open up ssh directly to everyone.

I haven't done that for years, prefering instead to change ports to an uncommon one and even then that port is only opened upon port knocking. My logs are so much easier to parse. (These days in nftables instead of iptables.) There actually is some security through obscurity, despite everyone loving to bandwagon otherwise.

not sure if that's obscurity. changing the port means you have to scan the whole port range. port knocking gives you another 2-4 bytes of entropy. (a determined attacker will try all the port knocking permutations)

Seems like putting bars on the windows. You're taking a couple of well known steps to make things a little harder for an attacker.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society only functions because we respect the informal intentions of other people. I agree wholeheartedly, in the local scale person-to-person sense. But your argument is knocking down a straw man, by coming at it from the other direction. I'm not advocating for being an asshole via finding loopholes, but against the ridiculousness of creating a second set of half-formal rules to repair deficiencies in the fully fo…

Law is interpreted by the courts, which creates jurisprudence. The letter of the law is subject to the interpretation of the courts to a very great extent. Edit: I misread the comment I responded to, and as the poster rightly pointed out, my comment is just stating the obvious. Sorry about that.

How is that aspect not already incorporated in what I've said?

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, well I guess folks using it should be just as careful as the rest of us. Someone with a 116.90.81.14 ip was really interested in it. Username "bernard" is also a new one on me.

Lets make a big database of the popular usernames and passwords as of this moment. Has no one done this?

https://xato.net/today-i-am-releasing-ten-million-passwords-...

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#27
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would be nice if cloud providers automatically had a fence around your subnet with an ssh proxy that did this stuff already. Seems crazy that typically you open up ssh directly to everyone.

I haven't done that for years, prefering instead to change ports to an uncommon one and even then that port is only opened upon port knocking. My logs are so much easier to parse. (These days in nftables instead of iptables.) There actually is some security through obscurity, despite everyone loving to bandwagon otherwise.

The complaint isn't that it is worthless, it is that it is worthless if that is your only security measure.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Law is interpreted by the courts, which creates jurisprudence. The letter of the law is subject to the interpretation of the courts to a very great extent. Edit: I misread the comment I responded to, and as the poster rightly pointed out, my comment is just stating the obvious. Sorry about that.

How is that aspect not already incorporated in what I've said?

You’re absolutely right, I misread your comment.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't done that for years, prefering instead to change ports to an uncommon one and even then that port is only opened upon port knocking. My logs are so much easier to parse. (These days in nftables instead of iptables.) There actually is some security through obscurity, despite everyone loving to bandwagon otherwise.

The complaint isn't that it is worthless, it is that it is worthless if that is your only security measure.

Or any other trade off you make on the assumption you have more defense than you really do, surprisingly common.

Re: An ‘Iceberg’ of Unseen Crimes: Many Cyber Offenses Go Unreported

#30

For entire classes of online crime, from a purely data perspective I wonder if providing a way to anonymously report a crime would help? Things like extortion, cheating spouses, lewd photos, revenge porn tend to be quite embarrassing, and perhaps pursuing justice isn't worth getting exposed. But knowing names, emails, patterns, and other details might help at least paint a better picture of the true nature of online…

An informal and anonymous process to allow the public to arbitrarily submit people’s names to a criminal watchlist? What could go wrong?
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