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Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

theguardian.com

21–30 of 79 posts

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#21
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India only has a 1.2% population growth rate including an aging population ( https://www.statista.com/statistics/254469/median-age-of-the... ) which is down from 2.2% in 1980 and well below it's ~7% GDP growth rate. They are simply dealing with the normal issues for a rapidly developing nation. Plus the new generation entering the work force is based on their population growth rate ~20 years ago.

I am not sure what is the data source on statista but the last census happened in 2011: http://www.simplydecoded.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/TH01... The last decade was the only one where the population growth has slowed. And even then the growth was ~17% in 10 years.

This has a nice visualisation:

https://www.populationpyramid.net/india/2017/

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#22

Reminded me we hired an indian android developer (contractor) through a phone interview (in US). When “he” showed up for work, it wasn’t him. The contractor who actually showed up couldn’t answer the same questions.

Oh the old bait and switch works very well for telephone interviews. Remove them ideally.

Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet. Something that the interviewee cannot pass onto the 'real' candidate who will appear on the first day. On the other hand, fining the real candidate is the worst way possible, it has to be better than that.

It can help prevent this attempt of 'baiting and switching' to a lesser competent candidate in the first place.

The attitude should change from 'Oh I can give this test, I'll pass it for sure and you can pay me $X for it', to 'Screw that, they'll find out immediately that it wasn't me.'

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#23

edited: Some grammatical errors. Great read, and full of issues that are discussed on HN everyday. Also, not a new topic, the call centers have been on the decline for long, and for good reasons. > -today, young people from agricultural castes want to work in offices and not farms. I wondered what other options were open to them. > Poojary read it out to me in his best American accent, which he had perfected by the e…

the British choose to chew their crap food

What, you don't like curry? :)

(cue "no true Scotsman" vis-a-vis UK curry!)

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#24

Reminded me we hired an indian android developer (contractor) through a phone interview (in US). When “he” showed up for work, it wasn’t him. The contractor who actually showed up couldn’t answer the same questions.

Oh the old bait and switch works very well for telephone interviews. Remove them ideally. Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet. Something that the interviewee cannot pass onto the 'real' candidate who will appear on the first day. On the other hand, fining the real candidate is the worst way possible, it has to be better than t…

> fining the real candidate is the worst way possible

I fail to understand why this is unacceptable. If I take a test for you, we both get in trouble.

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#25
post #14
post #9

This is like the boiler room stuff from "Wolf of Wall Street". Unfortunately it is not reviled rather held in awe. One thing which is never talked about in these articles is the failure of Indian government (past and present) to find effective family planning policies. Population growth is through the roof and hence unemployment is huge. With not much left in terms of job prospects lot of people turn to shady stuff.…

> One thing which is never talked about in these articles is the failure of Indian government (past and present) to find effective family planning policies. Population growth is through the roof and hence unemployment is huge. Looking at the actual data https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.DYN.TFRT.IN?location... it's not clear that the government could have found more effective family planning policies, save for…

Indeed, they've actually done fairly well with population growth imo in recent years. Many states are at or below tfr replacement level as seen here:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_states_ranking_by_ferti... . It's the poorest states that still have challenges and even then overall growth continues to trend downwards. Population momentum is a problem but can't do much about that now. Interestingly all of the people mentioned in the article who moved to Delhi to become part of the scamming are from the red (high tfr) states like Uttar Pradesh and Bihar, but that may just be a coincidence.

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#27

Reminded me we hired an indian android developer (contractor) through a phone interview (in US). When “he” showed up for work, it wasn’t him. The contractor who actually showed up couldn’t answer the same questions.

Oh the old bait and switch works very well for telephone interviews. Remove them ideally. Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet. Something that the interviewee cannot pass onto the 'real' candidate who will appear on the first day. On the other hand, fining the real candidate is the worst way possible, it has to be better than t…

In our case he was so bad we were able to fire him first day fortunately. I still don’t understand how he thought it was going to work

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh the old bait and switch works very well for telephone interviews. Remove them ideally. Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet. Something that the interviewee cannot pass onto the 'real' candidate who will appear on the first day. On the other hand, fining the real candidate is the worst way possible, it has to be better than t…

> fining the real candidate is the worst way possible I fail to understand why this is unacceptable. If I take a test for you, we both get in trouble.

They pay a non-decent amounts to these test takers, because they are desperate, and most likely not very well off. So they're already in the red when they appear for the job they are not qualified for.

Some do this because they think that the job market is skewed against them, and might also have the sentiments that these 'seats' within the companies are reserved for 'rich people' or the 'upper castes', when that's hardly the case. Bear in mind some companies/universities/schools only hire from a certain caste, that is a thing. One's caste is clearly mentioned in the Ration Cards, not sure if it's the case on the Aadhar Card.

Fining them for an opportunity they thought they were going to get by 'gaming the system they were gamed out of' is just kicking them repeatedly, and does no one any good.

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#29

edited: Some grammatical errors. Great read, and full of issues that are discussed on HN everyday. Also, not a new topic, the call centers have been on the decline for long, and for good reasons. > -today, young people from agricultural castes want to work in offices and not farms. I wondered what other options were open to them. > Poojary read it out to me in his best American accent, which he had perfected by the e…

the British choose to chew their crap food What, you don't like curry? :) (cue "no true Scotsman" vis-a-vis UK curry!)

hah yes the infamous curry was most of my diet throughout my life in uni. That and pot noodles might be the leading cause of my future diabetic pancreas.

Re: Scammers gaming India’s overcrowded job market

#30

Reminded me we hired an indian android developer (contractor) through a phone interview (in US). When “he” showed up for work, it wasn’t him. The contractor who actually showed up couldn’t answer the same questions.

Oh the old bait and switch works very well for telephone interviews. Remove them ideally. Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet. Something that the interviewee cannot pass onto the 'real' candidate who will appear on the first day. On the other hand, fining the real candidate is the worst way possible, it has to be better than t…

> Perhaps a solution to this could be to give the interviewee something that only he can give the interviewer back when they meet.

A video call as part of the hiring process, instead of a phone call, solves the solution trivially. Since we're talking about software engineers, which are (supposedly) used to these tools, there are no associated costs (I refer human, not monetary ones).

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