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The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

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Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#21

Post by icebraining »

FLUX-YOU wrote: post #16
davidmr wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any currency or commodity or derivative for which that statement is not true? It seems self-evident that if you own a lot of something like gold, dollars, BTC, sterling, etc. and you sell it, its value relative to what you're selling it for declines.

I'd bet that large holders of gold sell small amounts all the time without the market going nuts and kicking off volatility swings. But I could be wrong. It's less the mechanism and the implication that people imply by following whales. Why should a store-of-value market react when someone sells a small amount regardless of their current holdings?

Who said anything about a small amount?

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#22

Post by libertine »

drcross wrote: post #15

Whales can only sell once. It's also not in their self interest to make a market collapse, why would they depress the price of the thing they are trying to sell? When whales do sell many smaller buyers then take ownership of their coins decreasing the chance of future volatility. These concerns are being exaggerated too much.

1,000 people is a really small number, and if mildly organized they can easily manipulate the market by controlling a great slice of the supply side.

Too much control on the hands of few.

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#23

Post by tfha »

yellowstuff wrote: post #19
davidmr wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any currency or commodity or derivative for which that statement is not true? It seems self-evident that if you own a lot of something like gold, dollars, BTC, sterling, etc. and you sell it, its value relative to what you're selling it for declines.

Buying any asset pushes the price up and selling pushes the price down. It's a matter of sensitivity. The Chinese government could probably push down the price of USD a few percent by announcing a policy change today, but one guy could potentially push Bitcoin prices down significantly with a keystroke.

At great cost to himself. Dumping coins like that is not free, you pay a huge price due to slippage.

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#24

Post by inglondon »

empath75 wrote: post #12
kazen44 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the major difference between fiat and bitcoin in this case seems to be that the whales in case of fiat currency are either the central banks (like the FED and ECB) or large international banks who own a lot of currency?

in the case of diamonds, it's deBeers.

There is also no derivatives market for diamonds

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#26

Post by FLUX-YOU »

icebraining wrote: post #21
FLUX-YOU wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd bet that large holders of gold sell small amounts all the time without the market going nuts and kicking off volatility swings. But I could be wrong. It's less the mechanism and the implication that people imply by following whales. Why should a store-of-value market react when someone sells a small amount regardless of their current holdings?

Who said anything about a small amount?

The article that I quoted.

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#27

Post by FLUX-YOU »

astura wrote: post #18
FLUX-YOU wrote: post #4

>Holders of large amounts of bitcoin are often known as whales. And they’re becoming a worry for investors. They can send prices plummeting by selling even a portion of their holdings. That's not indicative of something that's a store of value.

It's not unprecedented https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_Thursday

That's a good counter-point, and it's difficult to counter without some knowledge of manipulation within BTC markets.

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#28

Post by sevensor »

It's interesting to see how this is playing out. Libertarians have long argued that government-issued fiat currency is a tool of state oppression. Now we have a real-world experiment demonstrating on a grand scale what happens when you create a currency by consensual fiat. I'd be interested to hear what libertarians think about this: Is Bitcoin truly the kind of currency libertarians have been advocating? Have I mischaracterized the libertarian position? What do you think about the concentration of Bitcoins in the hands of a small number of people? Where is this experiment going in the long run?

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#29

Post by bufferoverflow »

marsrover wrote: post #2

I really enjoy investing in cryptocurrencies. However, I have a lot of doubt this is going to make the world a more fair or better place. It's going to create a wealth gap like has never been seen in first world countries.

But this time it's voluntarily. Anybody can get it at any time. I've been telling my friends and family since 2012, and only one of them invested. Those who take risks, get rewarded. You can't win if you refuse to try.

Of course, there are truly poor people out there who can't have a dollar to spare, but it's mostly due to geography, corruption or war, not evil capitalists.

Re: The Bitcoin Whales: 1,000 People Who Own 40 Percent of the Market

#30

Post by neaden »

drcross wrote: post #15

Whales can only sell once. It's also not in their self interest to make a market collapse, why would they depress the price of the thing they are trying to sell? When whales do sell many smaller buyers then take ownership of their coins decreasing the chance of future volatility. These concerns are being exaggerated too much.

It's not in their interest but things happen. Lots of these people live in China right? Let's say some economic downturn happens in China, or government policy changes or something and they need to liquidate some of their bitcoin assets in a hurry all the sudden you could have a market collapse.
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