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Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

businessinsider.com

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Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#21

Post by noetic_techy »

You can already buy KetoKaNa and similar products on amazon, so I don't see how this is any different, nor innovative.

The article hints to studies, but so far I have not heard of anyone combining ketone esters with carb rich diets. Typically they are only used to get you through the slump in ketone production when you first start the keto diet.

It seems this would have been a natural evolutionary path if ketones were meant to co-exist with carbs. Why is it that your body shuts off ketone production with carbs present? Why not keep them both available. Circumventing this without studying the effects first may not be wise.

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#22

Post by bdm »

40acres wrote: post #14

I've done Keto several times, and while the results were always fantastic the hardest thing is that 3-4 day period where you need to watch what you eat to enter ketosis, one false move can reset your progress and really discourage you; however for me once I'm in ketosis I'm pretty disciplined at keeping it up. If this drink can get me into ketosis quickly and allow me to maintain it by following the regular diet then…

Good to hear about your experiences with keto. I do cyclic keto, going into ketogenic diet for periods and then coming back to "normal" (still relatively low carb). Cyclic keto has shown benefits, and it doesn't have the trade-offs of going full keto.

For people who struggle with symptoms of keto flu (ie, those ~3 days ramping up to the keto diet, and blood glucose is low but the body is not yet producing ketones in high levels) the drink could help alleviate this as people transition.

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#23

Post by stefantheard »

bdm wrote: post #7
cvaidya1986 wrote: post #4

Seems like this effect can be reproduced by intermittent fasting or a keto diet.

Sort of! You can enter ketosis through IF and keto diet (we run WeFast, a big facebook fasting group, and I fast 36 hours every week). What's special about HVMN Ketone is that you can get into ketosis with just a drink. And it lets you maintain carb levels at the same time, unlike keto diet & IF, which is a big plus for the sports performance gains.

Can you provide the research or documentation proving that this drink will immediately get you into ketosis? How long does it last? Are you actually just faking out ketone strips for some period of time?

Can I eat carbs every day but drink this and stay in ketosis? That seems really unlikely.

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#24

Post by rhinoceraptor »

Chaebixi wrote: post #2

> The drink comes in a bottle about the size of a 5-Hour Energy shot. It's clear and has no smell. The taste, however, burns like rubbing alcohol. It caused our eyes to tear. We gagged, loudly. > Still, after a few minutes, our stomachs ached. A flavor like nail polish remover lingered on our lips long after drinking and was only extinguished with ice water. Sounds great.

I think that's just ketone esters. That actually sounds pretty pleasant compared to the descriptions I've heard of earlier ketone esters: http://eatingacademy.com/personal/experience-exogenous-keton...

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#25

Post by vanattab »

bdm wrote: post #5
Chaebixi wrote: post #2

> The drink comes in a bottle about the size of a 5-Hour Energy shot. It's clear and has no smell. The taste, however, burns like rubbing alcohol. It caused our eyes to tear. We gagged, loudly. > Still, after a few minutes, our stomachs ached. A flavor like nail polish remover lingered on our lips long after drinking and was only extinguished with ice water. Sounds great.

Hi, co-founder here. Yes it does have a kick to it. It's made for performance (is > 98% ketone & water) not to be the most delicious thing ever. The writer's response here is totally legit -- but we've also demo'd with pro athletes, Navy SEAL's, etc. and they just knock it back, no big deal!

Of the 98% that is ketone and water how much is water? ;)

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#26

Post by rhinoceraptor »

noetic_techy wrote: post #21

You can already buy KetoKaNa and similar products on amazon, so I don't see how this is any different, nor innovative. The article hints to studies, but so far I have not heard of anyone combining ketone esters with carb rich diets. Typically they are only used to get you through the slump in ketone production when you first start the keto diet. It seems this would have been a natural evolutionary path if ketones wer…

If the graph on their website is to be believed, then it (ketone esters) should be a lot more potent than ketone salts. I have tried KetoCana and I didn't notice any cognitive difference, or much of a difference in ketones as measured by my Ketonix (although that measures breath acetone, not blood BHB, and probably not super accurately).

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#27

Post by rhinoceraptor »

stefantheard wrote: post #23
bdm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sort of! You can enter ketosis through IF and keto diet (we run WeFast, a big facebook fasting group, and I fast 36 hours every week). What's special about HVMN Ketone is that you can get into ketosis with just a drink. And it lets you maintain carb levels at the same time, unlike keto diet & IF, which is a big plus for the sports performance gains.

Can you provide the research or documentation proving that this drink will immediately get you into ketosis? How long does it last? Are you actually just faking out ketone strips for some period of time? Can I eat carbs every day but drink this and stay in ketosis? That seems really unlikely.

The graph on their website (if to be believed) shows a comparison between their ketone ester and a ketone salt.

Also, if I remember correctly, ketone esters were originally developed for use in rebreather SCUBA diving. The concentration of oxygen makes seizures much more likely. Since ketogenic diets are useful for preventing seizures, the military wanted a "ketogenic diet in a pill".

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#28

Post by Floegipoky »

bdm wrote: post #18
joulesforaloop wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So many questions... Like: when you say "ketone" you mean what kind of ketone/ketone ester...? My first thought when they complained about it tasting like nail polish remover was that if it involves acetone, it is nail polish remover. Second, I wonder what this would be doing to metabolism of other carbs... I've read that using these ketone esters without decreasing carb intake might actually make things worse from a…

It is D-BHB, not acetone. https://help.hvmn.com/hvmn-ketone/what-is-inside-hvmn-ketone When taken with carbs, as was done in the athlete studies, performance output increases because the body has access to both types of energy. The ketones are used first, protecting the glucose for later use.

My understanding is that many elite-level athletes can still achieve ketosis while consuming a significant amount of carbs (around what most people would probably consider normal intake) because they're training so much and burning so much glycogen.

What happens when it's an average person who doesn't have the same energy expenditure and metabolic efficiency as an elite athlete?

Re: Startup behind chewable coffee created a performance-enhancing 'superhuman fuel'

#29

Post by tedmiston »

neves wrote: post #3

I've been going in the opposite direction. Last year I've bought an aeropress coffe device to improve my coffee at work. Last week I've started to use a manual grinder so I can use high quality whole beans. My morning and after lunch coffees are my personal rituals. A chewable coffee looks completely detestable. :-)

I've tried the Go cubes. I wouldn't really think of them as a replacement for a nice cup of coffee. They're more "I need this caffeinated burst and I don't want to deal with going to a coffee shop or grinding/brewing/etc". More like a way to get effects of coffee or an energy drink without coffee.

It's sort of like how Soylent Coffiest is a coffee alternative with other things that reduce the downsides of coffee, but it's "meta coffee", not exactly coffee.

By the way, another alternative to preparing your own coffee by hand that's good is Sudden Coffee. It's an instant coffee that's like a freeze dried pour over.

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