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The Great College Loan Swindle
21–30 of 118 posts
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#22Most scorn of universities and loan programs never seem to address a serious problem: Students taking on debt to fund degrees with little market value, or few job prospects. Racking up $100k to get an interdisciplinary degree in women and gender studies might sound awesome, but not at the cost of a school like NYU.[0] I think schools should be required to press upon students prior to taking out these loans honest and…
If you do some kind of investment (say, in stocks of some company), you first read up on investment, the market this company works in, products this company is planning etc. in particular if you go in debt for this investment.
So why can't one simply expect from grown-up people to do the same for the degree that ones planes do get?
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#23It’s interesting that the real perpetrators don’t get much of Taibbi’s scorn. The loan industry are just opportunists, and for the most part students loans have been taken over by the government anyway. The real criminals here are teachers, parents, and employers, who have created a culture where people are compelled to get completely unnecessary higher education. Here, you need a college degree to be an administrati…
Interestingly, Germany had a push over the last thirty years or so towards requiring higher education for jobs that have historically never needed that.
As an example, a large chunk of my classmates did not study after the Abitur (which is the qualification for university studies and can be received with about 18 from the Gymnasium – our highest secondary school). Many went to local banks and became bank tellers and back office workers.
Bank tellers used to have "Mittlere Reife", which you get at the Realschule (in the middle of secondary schools) with about 16. There are still bank tellers with Mittlere Reife, but since the banks can choose to get young people with Abitur, they do so.
Becoming a baker or a joiner used to be the domain of young people who graduated from the Hauptschule – the lowest of the secondary schools. Today, many are from the Realschule.
Still, the apprenticeship system works, even if the standards have been raised.
Even more interesting to young people who think about going to college (because that's the audience we're talking about here) is the "dual system", where they study half of the time, but with lower academic expectations (less theorizing, more practical learning), and spend the other half in a company where they can immediately put their new knowledge to practice. They are paid by the company (enough to move out from home) and are obligated to work at that company after graduation for a few years. It is quite a bit like apprenticeship, but for white-collar jobs.
It is less prestigious than studying at a university, but companies love those students, because they are well-integrated into the company from the beginning, and some of those students do have rather fast careers afterwards.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#24[deleted]
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#25Most scorn of universities and loan programs never seem to address a serious problem: Students taking on debt to fund degrees with little market value, or few job prospects. Racking up $100k to get an interdisciplinary degree in women and gender studies might sound awesome, but not at the cost of a school like NYU.[0] I think schools should be required to press upon students prior to taking out these loans honest and…
If you do some kind of investment (say, in stocks of some company), you first read up on investment, the market this company works in, products this company is planning etc. in particular if you go in debt for this investment. So why can't one simply expect from grown-up people to do the same for the degree that ones planes do get?
One can, but we're talking about 18-year-olds fresh out of high school here.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you do some kind of investment (say, in stocks of some company), you first read up on investment, the market this company works in, products this company is planning etc. in particular if you go in debt for this investment. So why can't one simply expect from grown-up people to do the same for the degree that ones planes do get?
One can, but we're talking about 18-year-olds fresh out of high school here.
But the parents are surely not 18 years old and just out of highschool.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#27Most scorn of universities and loan programs never seem to address a serious problem: Students taking on debt to fund degrees with little market value, or few job prospects. Racking up $100k to get an interdisciplinary degree in women and gender studies might sound awesome, but not at the cost of a school like NYU.[0] I think schools should be required to press upon students prior to taking out these loans honest and…
I think the colleges should have some skin in the game and be at least partially on the hook if the loan defaults. That should prevent some of the completely egregious price gouging.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#28It’s interesting that the real perpetrators don’t get much of Taibbi’s scorn. The loan industry are just opportunists, and for the most part students loans have been taken over by the government anyway. The real criminals here are teachers, parents, and employers, who have created a culture where people are compelled to get completely unnecessary higher education. Here, you need a college degree to be an administrati…
Interestingly, Germany had a push over the last thirty years or so towards requiring higher education for jobs that have historically never needed that. As an example, a large chunk of my classmates did not study after the Abitur (which is the qualification for university studies and can be received with about 18 from the Gymnasium – our highest secondary school). Many went to local banks and became bank tellers and…
> Still, the apprenticeship system works, even if the standards have been raised.
The standards for these jobs surely have raised a litle - but mostly the standards of Hauptschulabschluss and Realschulabschluss (I don't know how to translate these words into English) have declined. Things that every graduate of a Hauptschule, say, 40-50 years ago, had to know, say, in writing German text or numeracy, can not be assumed anymore. So the problem in my opinion mostly lies in the decline of standards in schools instead of new, harder requirements to become an apprentice.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#29It’s interesting that the real perpetrators don’t get much of Taibbi’s scorn. The loan industry are just opportunists, and for the most part students loans have been taken over by the government anyway. The real criminals here are teachers, parents, and employers, who have created a culture where people are compelled to get completely unnecessary higher education. Here, you need a college degree to be an administrati…
Quoting the article: "Going to college doesn't guarantee a good job, far from it, but the data show that not going dooms most young people to an increasingly shallow pool of the very crappiest, lowest-paying jobs. There's a lot of stick, but not much carrot, in the education game. [...] the squeeze on the un-degreed grows tighter, increasing further that original negative incentive: Don't go to college, and you'll be…
I didn’t go to college and I’m making 6 figures as a software developer. I’d say half the people I work with never went to college either.
Re: The Great College Loan Swindle
#30It’s interesting that the real perpetrators don’t get much of Taibbi’s scorn. The loan industry are just opportunists, and for the most part students loans have been taken over by the government anyway. The real criminals here are teachers, parents, and employers, who have created a culture where people are compelled to get completely unnecessary higher education. Here, you need a college degree to be an administrati…
Quoting the article: "Going to college doesn't guarantee a good job, far from it, but the data show that not going dooms most young people to an increasingly shallow pool of the very crappiest, lowest-paying jobs. There's a lot of stick, but not much carrot, in the education game. [...] the squeeze on the un-degreed grows tighter, increasing further that original negative incentive: Don't go to college, and you'll be…
> It is competitions and if you dont compete, you loose for sure.
The wrong move in the game was in my opinion rather to give birth to children if you cannot afford their education.