Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others • Hacker News Board

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#21

Post by iamben » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:12 AM UTC

tome wrote: post #19

iamben wrote: post #18

Just based on some of the comments here - I think this loosely translates not as to literally disregard what others are doing, but more to disregard how you _think_ others are interpreting the work that you yourself are doing. In other words, believe in yourself and everything seems a little easier.

I don't think that's the case at all. It explicitly says "You have to worry about your own work and ignore what everyone else is doing", not "ignore how everyone else is interpreting the work you yourself are doing". Of course this advice isn't good for those who work in a team.

Perhaps, yup. I could be taking it entirely the wrong way, and maybe that's the beauty of it :-)

I've spent a lot of time trying to deal with imposter syndrome. I guess I saw the parallel.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#22

Post by chairmanwow » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:21 AM UTC

kornish wrote: post #4

have_faith wrote: post #3

Does this work for Feynman, because he is a genius? in the same way that lots of successful people offer tidbits of advice that wouldn't apply to someone in different circumstances, or perhaps with a different level of intellect.

Your comment reminds me of the Feynman Algorithm [0], which is pure gold: 1. Write down the problem. 2. Think real hard. 3. Write down the solution. "The Feynman algorithm was facetiously suggested by Murray Gell-Mann, a colleague of Feynman, in a New York Times interview." [0]: http://wiki.c2.com/?FeynmanAlgorithm

I think I might start suggesting this to my coworkers + friends.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#23

Post by watwut » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:22 AM UTC

omegant wrote: post #10

have_faith wrote: post #3

Does this work for Feynman, because he is a genius? in the same way that lots of successful people offer tidbits of advice that wouldn't apply to someone in different circumstances, or perhaps with a different level of intellect.

I think it works for everybody but you need to be brave or crazy enough to apply it. If you pay attention to what the others are doing, you are working inside what is socially acceptable in your group and usually you are not going to go against the stablished truth. Hence you will not be able to add any breakthrough to your area of expertise. Feynman as the post says, experienced this social anxiety once he had the f…

It depends on your social status and general situation a lot - some people get punished hard when they disregard others and are in no position to do it. Others can get away with that mostly. A lot depends on whether at least portion of people is willing to give you benefit of the doubt or whether someone criticizing you as always taken at a face value.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#24

Post by SuoDuanDao » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:30 AM UTC

have_faith wrote: post #3

Does this work for Feynman, because he is a genius? in the same way that lots of successful people offer tidbits of advice that wouldn't apply to someone in different circumstances, or perhaps with a different level of intellect.

Warran Buffet is well known for his 'insulate yourself from public opinion' quote. It appears to me that disregarding the mainstream is necessary to be an outlier in any field. The rub might be though, that outliers lie on both sides of the bell curve.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#25

Post by sidcool » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:31 AM UTC

It may be a stretch to think that what worked for the great Feynman would work for me.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#26

Post by sidcool » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:33 AM UTC

grabcocque wrote: post #7

I'm not sure if it's reassuring or utterly disheartening that even somebody as brilliant as Feynman can be laid low with impostor syndrome.

On the contrary, it's the super Genius who are more likely to suffer from bouts of Imposter syndrome.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#27

Post by bsmithers » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:33 AM UTC

It's interesting that a few people are relating this to team work. I think that is a misinterpretation. By 'others' I would infer something more like 'competitors', though I mean that relatively loosely. Essentially, ignore what other labs are working on and focus on your own (group's) works.

My own PhD supervisor had a similar attitude, though it runs against how many others approach a problem I feel. For example, I'm unconvinced that starting a project with a thorough literature review is necessarily the best plan. It can shroud your thoughts, make you miss the same things everyone else has and make you feel that all the work has already been done.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#28

Post by SuoDuanDao » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:38 AM UTC

j7ake wrote: post #12

In general it is high risk and high reward. You need to have sufficient confidence in yourself that what you're doing is valuable to a community that is hostile to you. If your work ends up not being recognised as important, then your losses are much larger than if you followed the crowd and did incremental research. There is probably analogous stories with start up scene, incremental start ups get funded, those cons…

Good point. I'd add that the expected payback from doing incremental work is also a variable that can go through extreme changes over the medium term, which can lead to changes in whether it's rational to play it safe or attempt to blaze a trail. That makes me wonder whether changes in rates of entrepreneurialism lead or lag economic downturns...

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#29

Post by Asdfbla » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:39 AM UTC

I find it is a hard balance to strike, because on the one hand I think you certainly need input, inspiration or feedback from other people and people smarter or more accomplished than you, but on the other hand you it's not good to get self-conscious about your ideas or achievements relative to theirs.

In principle those to things could be unrelated, but in practice it can be hard to separate those two aspects.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#30

Post by mannykannot » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:40 AM UTC

srean wrote: post #17

Insanity wrote: post #11

It was a pleasure to read, but of course it should be taken with a grain of salt and not applied to every field :-) Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well! You might end up with a good solution to the problem, but you'll also manage to piss off a lot of people ^^ A more…

> Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well! If you are competent, have a realistic estimate of your competence, this might not be a bad idea if what you need is a purely technical solution. In many big organizations (lets leave them nameless) most of your time might be goi…

Unfortunately, for every one who is that person in that situation, there are several who merely think they are, at least in my experience (the most common form seems to be the covert rewriter whose work is more 'pure', 'object-oriented | functional', 'general', 'flexible', 'performant', 'reusable', or my favorite, 'simple' (for some definition of 'simple') than will ever be needed, at the cost of considerable additional (and undocumented) complexity.)