How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program • Hacker News Board

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#21

Post by mason55 » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 3:16 PM UTC

mikeash wrote: post #17

totalZero wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With Amir. Given the context of an intelligence officer knocking on an unfamiliar person's hotel room door unexpected and asking them to defect, I think "salaam habibi" would strike most Farsi speakers as a bizarre and malapropos greeting. "Hola amigo. I’m from the CIA, and I want you to board a plane with me to the United States." I see it as an indicator of careless journalism that the author is citing an unnamed s…

I get what you're saying, but "hola amigo" is a really bad example of it. There are 40 million Spanish speakers in the US and tens of millions more use Spanish phrases routinely as a personality quirk. "Hola" and "amigo" are both words that I'd expect most Americans to understand, and I wouldn't bat an eye if a CIA agent greeted my in that way, assuming the context wasn't too formal. Maybe a better example would be..…

Yeah, maybe I watch too many movies, but "hola amigo" feels like a totally appropriate greeting before you're about to do some shady spy shit. I think that it's actually a good greeting because it indicates to the other person that this interaction is about to be a bit informal.

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#22

Post by jgalt212 » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 3:23 PM UTC

amir wrote: post #2

I stopped reading after > To show his sincerity and goodwill, the agent put his hand over his heart. “Salam habibi,” he said. Either the reporter, or the CIA hasn't done their research. Habibi is Arabic, and that's not how Iranian greet each other, especially if they want to show sincerity and goodwill.

this is a great thread for ngate. HN debating whether or not the CIA's tradecraft was up to snuff.

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#23

Post by TACIXAT » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 3:37 PM UTC

vectorEQ wrote: post #7

if u want to know what iranian nuclear scientists do for a living.. they don't make bombs :P https://www.thenewenergyindustry.com/project/the-story-of-me... But maybe now it make sense why they want to thwart their research efforts and destroy their 'reactors' ? ;P

When I loaded it, I was like wow, this looks like some free energy non-sense. Then it was!

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#24

Post by unethical_ban » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 3:46 PM UTC

Isn't it bad that we are talking about American spycraft against a rival, regarding a method they may still need to employ? This isn't like researching the Bay of Pigs.

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#25

Post by tryingagainbro » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 3:47 PM UTC

amir wrote: post #2

I stopped reading after > To show his sincerity and goodwill, the agent put his hand over his heart. “Salam habibi,” he said. Either the reporter, or the CIA hasn't done their research. Habibi is Arabic, and that's not how Iranian greet each other, especially if they want to show sincerity and goodwill.

“I’m from the CIA, and I want you to board a plane with me to the United States.”

I'm sure his salutation was forgiven...the offer is what makes him think a trillion things a second.

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#26

Post by throwaway9728 » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 4:22 PM UTC

And let us not forget the endless string of assassinations carried out by foreign intelligence agencies against Iranian nuclear scientists [0][1][2][3][4], indiscriminately killing civilians – women and children.

Of course, we as a nation are so overwhelmingly vilified by US media that such tragedies happening to us don't get awarded the label of "Terrorism."

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majid_Shahriari [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fereydoon_Abbasi [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masoud_Alimohammadi [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darioush_Rezaeinejad [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mostafa_Ahmadi-Roshan

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#27

Post by tr1ck5t3r » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 4:34 PM UTC

jgalt212 wrote: post #22

amir wrote: post #2

I stopped reading after > To show his sincerity and goodwill, the agent put his hand over his heart. “Salam habibi,” he said. Either the reporter, or the CIA hasn't done their research. Habibi is Arabic, and that's not how Iranian greet each other, especially if they want to show sincerity and goodwill.

this is a great thread for ngate. HN debating whether or not the CIA's tradecraft was up to snuff.

More to the point, considering Trump is just a mouthpiece or easily led to a conclusion based on data given to him by the the Industrial Military Machine,will be making a decision on Iran's nuclear program soon, is this piece designed to shape opinions before the official announcement? So many ramifications, which path do you follow?

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#28

Post by gr__or » Wed, Oct 11, 2017, 12:36 AM UTC

throwaway9728 wrote: post #26

And let us not forget the endless string of assassinations carried out by foreign intelligence agencies against Iranian nuclear scientists [0][1][2][3][4], indiscriminately killing civilians – women and children. Of course, we as a nation are so overwhelmingly vilified by US media that such tragedies happening to us don't get awarded the label of "Terrorism." [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majid_Shahriari [1] http…

I'm certainly no fan of the CIA and the fucked up shit it's done (and still doing), especially to your country. But isn't there a difference between a somewhat targeted assassination and an attack which's only target is maximum civillian damage (aka the typical terror bomb plot)? I don't want to justify these actions, I just think there is a qualitative difference.

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#29

Post by eesmith » Wed, Oct 11, 2017, 1:06 AM UTC

gr__or wrote: post #28

throwaway9728 wrote: post #26

And let us not forget the endless string of assassinations carried out by foreign intelligence agencies against Iranian nuclear scientists [0][1][2][3][4], indiscriminately killing civilians – women and children. Of course, we as a nation are so overwhelmingly vilified by US media that such tragedies happening to us don't get awarded the label of "Terrorism." [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majid_Shahriari [1] http…

I'm certainly no fan of the CIA and the fucked up shit it's done (and still doing), especially to your country. But isn't there a difference between a somewhat targeted assassination and an attack which's only target is maximum civillian damage (aka the typical terror bomb plot)? I don't want to justify these actions, I just think there is a qualitative difference.

Sure, there's a difference. There's also a difference between first and second degree murder, but they are both still murder.

From what I can tell, most terrorists want to achieve a more specific goal than just to maximize civilian damage. Here are some groups which are called terrorist organizations:

Earth Liberation Front: carries out property damage related to fur farming, meat packing, GMO research, logging, etc.

Army of God, a Christian anti-abortionist group: kidnapped a doctor who performed abortions, and his wife, murdered or attempted to murder abortion providers, and carried out clinic bombings and arson.

In both cases the goal was to increase the perceived costs of respectively exploiting the environment and carrying out abortions.

What is the difference between a targeted murder of a foreign scientists by the CIA and a targeted murder of an abortion provider?

(I use "murder" because I think "assassination" is a fancy name partially meant to justify murder as an aspect of state power.)

Re: How the CIA Staged Sham Academic Conferences to Thwart Iran’s Nuclear Program

#30

Post by gr__or » Wed, Oct 11, 2017, 9:16 AM UTC

eesmith wrote: post #29

gr__or wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm certainly no fan of the CIA and the fucked up shit it's done (and still doing), especially to your country. But isn't there a difference between a somewhat targeted assassination and an attack which's only target is maximum civillian damage (aka the typical terror bomb plot)? I don't want to justify these actions, I just think there is a qualitative difference.

Sure, there's a difference. There's also a difference between first and second degree murder, but they are both still murder. From what I can tell, most terrorists want to achieve a more specific goal than just to maximize civilian damage. Here are some groups which are called terrorist organizations: Earth Liberation Front: carries out property damage related to fur farming, meat packing, GMO research, logging, etc.…

Thank you, good points. It is probably more of a spectrum than I previously stated. Though I'd personally also wouldn't call the ELF or Army of God terrorist organizations. That I'd reserve for untargeted civillian attacks that have the intent of striking fear. But given that the US government considers these organizations terrorist, it's only fair to call their CIA a terrorist organization.