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NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

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Re: NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

#21

Post by R_haterade »

ideonexus wrote: post #20
R_haterade wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

he proposed concentrating people into cities. Sounds a lot like a final solution to me. For real though that would be a situation where people were like lambs to the slaughter. People that close together are much easier to control, and that's not a good thing.

Actually, if I were proposing a "final solution," I would simply advocate that urban areas simply stop paying Federal and State taxes. Without government subsidization, rural areas unable to financially support themselves would vanish very quickly. But I'm not advocating that. I'm suggesting we provide support to dying communities to voluntarily relocate to where the jobs are. Communities that are doing fine would ob…

But they wouldn't be doing fine for long. Inevitably, policy would be structured that made those communities less able to fend for themselves. It always happens--structures of control always seek more control, and more people in fewer places means easier to control.

I'm afraid we're talking past each other--your arguments are about economics, mine concern the right to self-determination.

Re: NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

#22

Post by trapperkeeper74 »

Doesn’t address the problem by shifting externalities elsewhere and reinforces prejudices. Maybe instead of arrogant “quick fixes” it’s worth considering, lower TCO permanent solutions like micro apartments, real and integrated drug, health and mental healthcare coverage coordinated with social workers would address the major sources of costs (ie social services, emergency rooms and justice system).

Re: NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

#23

Post by ideonexus »

R_haterade wrote: post #21
ideonexus wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, if I were proposing a "final solution," I would simply advocate that urban areas simply stop paying Federal and State taxes. Without government subsidization, rural areas unable to financially support themselves would vanish very quickly. But I'm not advocating that. I'm suggesting we provide support to dying communities to voluntarily relocate to where the jobs are. Communities that are doing fine would ob…

But they wouldn't be doing fine for long. Inevitably, policy would be structured that made those communities less able to fend for themselves. It always happens--structures of control always seek more control, and more people in fewer places means easier to control. I'm afraid we're talking past each other--your arguments are about economics, mine concern the right to self-determination.

I don't think we are really talking past each other. To me this an issue of self-determination as well. I lived in a small town completely lacking employment opportunities for 10 years. The kids who were able to move out got careers, those who couldn't are stuck working in the service industry. With a little government assistance, they could move to where the careers are.

I regret the blunt, clinical way I communicated this in my original post.

Re: NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

#25

Post by Veratyr »

ideonexus wrote: post #19
tylerhou wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>subsidizing rural America to the tune of trillions of dollars I'm not sure where you're getting that number from. Here's a federal budget breakdown for FY2016 [1]: Non-discretionary spending: Social Security: $910 billion Medicare: $588 billion Medicaid: $368 billion Other: $563 billion Interest payments: $241 billion Discretionary spending: Defense: $584 billion Non-defense: $600 billion Spending on Medicare, Medic…

The problem is that you can't look up those stats. They don't exist. I'm not talking about Federal Budget alone or roads alone. I'm talking about Federal Taxes, State Taxes, and Local Taxes as they apply to roads, electric lines, sewage, bridges, community centers, and the myriad other projects that go into supporting a healthy community. There is a well established flow of taxes from urban areas to rural areas. We f…

> The problem is that you can't look up those stats. They don't exist.

Yes you can. You can obtain just about every budget online, whether it be state, federal or local. The person you're replying to showed you the federal budget which you seem to have conveniently ignored: https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/images/pubs...

You can see on that chart that the chunk which might apply to "roads, electric lines, sewage, bridges, community centers [...]" is the "Nondefense" chunk, which is $600b, or about 15% of the total federal budget.

I can't be bothered listing the budget for every state in the country but they're there. As for local budgets, they're going to apply to the local area.

Re: NYC offering to pay homeless a year’s worth of rent if they leave town

#26

Post by slededit »

trapperkeeper74 wrote: post #22

Doesn’t address the problem by shifting externalities elsewhere and reinforces prejudices. Maybe instead of arrogant “quick fixes” it’s worth considering, lower TCO permanent solutions like micro apartments, real and integrated drug, health and mental healthcare coverage coordinated with social workers would address the major sources of costs (ie social services, emergency rooms and justice system).

Most homeless are temporarily homeless, and such assistance would be a huge help to get them back on their feet. It is very difficult to pull yourself back up when you don't even have a secure place to sleep. Let alone shower or keep clean clothes. Homeless shelters help a little, but you end up needing to wait in line much of the day to get a spot making it real hard to go looking for jobs.
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