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Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

nytimes.com

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Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#21

Post by Santosh83 »

wiradikusuma wrote: post #5

I don't understand. == Stereotyping alert == At least in Malaysia and Singapore, even though there are a lot of Chinese (but not China national), "China girls" (from China) carries negative connotation. The reason is, many of them work in brothels, dodgy massage parlors, etc (you get the idea), and they're also known to "steal people's husbands" and being "gold diggers". In China itself, it's "common" for rich people…

I think gold diggers and prostitutes are a thing in practically every society or culture. "Outsiders" in most societies are also burdened with negative perceptions by the "insiders."

China is a huge country and we cannot generalise on any matter, except perhaps that history shows that vast nations crumble soon enough. Their very size seems to bring out inherent hurdles. This not just applies to China but all such similarly big countries... unless going forward we can evolve sufficiently to stave of death by a thousand paper cuts, but I'm not optimistic there...

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#22

Post by arethuza »

pmarreck wrote: post #15
throw2016 wrote: post #10

Why is Nytimes so concerned about China while failing completely to put the spotlight on the burgeoning surveillance culture at home? Who is going to talk about draconian surveillance, secret courts, secret orders, gag orders and government officials empowered to violate your dignity and privacy by searching your phone and personal effects. Why is Snowden still in Russia? Are we to pretend all this is not happening?…

OBJECTION: Whataboutist Fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism In addition, making a claim from a fresh anonymous account conveys the message that you do not actually stand behind it, giving it zero credence.

throw2016's account is 474 days old and has a karma of 663 - that doesn't look like a "fresh anonymous account".

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#23

Post by rtuulik »

wiradikusuma wrote: post #5

I don't understand. == Stereotyping alert == At least in Malaysia and Singapore, even though there are a lot of Chinese (but not China national), "China girls" (from China) carries negative connotation. The reason is, many of them work in brothels, dodgy massage parlors, etc (you get the idea), and they're also known to "steal people's husbands" and being "gold diggers". In China itself, it's "common" for rich people…

Its totally unrelated. Like most issues with prostitution, it is simply caused by poverty.

China is a very materialistic society with incredibly high inequality and it lacks any sort of welfare support network.

If you just walk around in shanghai, then the country might seem pretty close to first world levels of development. But if you go deeper inland, you will find hundreds of millions rural people who have been left behind, and still live in grinding poverty.

When you are that poor, then becoming a prostitute can be a acceptable option for you.

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#24

Post by [deleted] »

pmarreck wrote: post #15
throw2016 wrote: post #10

Why is Nytimes so concerned about China while failing completely to put the spotlight on the burgeoning surveillance culture at home? Who is going to talk about draconian surveillance, secret courts, secret orders, gag orders and government officials empowered to violate your dignity and privacy by searching your phone and personal effects. Why is Snowden still in Russia? Are we to pretend all this is not happening?…

OBJECTION: Whataboutist Fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism In addition, making a claim from a fresh anonymous account conveys the message that you do not actually stand behind it, giving it zero credence.

[deleted]

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#25

Post by [deleted] »

pmarreck wrote: post #15
throw2016 wrote: post #10

Why is Nytimes so concerned about China while failing completely to put the spotlight on the burgeoning surveillance culture at home? Who is going to talk about draconian surveillance, secret courts, secret orders, gag orders and government officials empowered to violate your dignity and privacy by searching your phone and personal effects. Why is Snowden still in Russia? Are we to pretend all this is not happening?…

OBJECTION: Whataboutist Fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism In addition, making a claim from a fresh anonymous account conveys the message that you do not actually stand behind it, giving it zero credence.

[deleted]

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#26

Post by sjcsjc »

pmarreck wrote: post #15
throw2016 wrote: post #10

Why is Nytimes so concerned about China while failing completely to put the spotlight on the burgeoning surveillance culture at home? Who is going to talk about draconian surveillance, secret courts, secret orders, gag orders and government officials empowered to violate your dignity and privacy by searching your phone and personal effects. Why is Snowden still in Russia? Are we to pretend all this is not happening?…

OBJECTION: Whataboutist Fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism In addition, making a claim from a fresh anonymous account conveys the message that you do not actually stand behind it, giving it zero credence.

I think I disagree that this is Whataboutism. I did not get the impression that the commenter was trying to "discredit an opponent's position by charging them with hypocrisy" (from the wiki link), but rather that he/she was pointing out an instance of apparent double standards.

I could be wrong. He/she might be attempting to defend China's policies. It just didn't come across that way to me.

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#29

Post by throw999890 »

Why is western media so concerned about China when their own government ramped up their control over their own people ? And hackernews mostly westerners going ga ga over this. You should be concerned about what’s happening at your home than what’s happening in some other country. Stop policing the world.

There is a proverb, fix the dust in your eye before trying to fix the dirt in someone else’s.

Re: Things You Cannot Say on China’s Internet

#30

Post by another_one2 »

pmarreck wrote: post #15
throw2016 wrote: post #10

Why is Nytimes so concerned about China while failing completely to put the spotlight on the burgeoning surveillance culture at home? Who is going to talk about draconian surveillance, secret courts, secret orders, gag orders and government officials empowered to violate your dignity and privacy by searching your phone and personal effects. Why is Snowden still in Russia? Are we to pretend all this is not happening?…

OBJECTION: Whataboutist Fallacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism In addition, making a claim from a fresh anonymous account conveys the message that you do not actually stand behind it, giving it zero credence.

This is not a fallacy at all. It is only a fallacy if there is a conclusion like "therefore $BAD_THING is not so bad after all".

The usual conclusion, however, is that both sides are bad (to a varying degree) and that the currently better side should be aware of slippery slopes.

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