Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#21

Post by jrockway » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 10:23 PM UTC

obsaysditto wrote: post #5

nkassis wrote: post #2

This is going to be interesting. If this guy wins, facebook is going to have a hell of a time surviving with uncertainty at the top.

Do you think most users will care about this? They'll just want to know if they can still see what their friends are doing, who has posted new photos, etc.

What if the new owner decides to "generate revenue" by selling your personal information to the highest bidder, and then turns the site off? Reselling the information is cheaper than keeping a bunch of programmers and sysadmins employed, after all.

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#22

Post by thinkcomp » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 10:39 PM UTC

I don't know anything about the case, but based on looking at the document, it looks like Mark's signature and handwriting to me. I guess it could have been copied from something else, though.

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#23

Post by thinkcomp » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 10:50 PM UTC

Elite wrote: post #14

According to the above Bloomberg Article: Ceglia claims his alleged contract, which refers to " The Face Book " was signed about nine months before Facebook was founded, the company said in court papers. According to the NYT from 2007: http://nyti.ms/cC0HwJ "An e-mail message, circulated widely by Mr. Greenspan to Harvard students on Sept. 19, 2003, describes the newest feature of houseSYSTEM, as " The Face Book " an…

Hi.

I'd never heard of Ceglia until a few days ago. Mark certainly didn't tell me about him, just like he didn't tell me about the Winklevosses. By the time Mark talked to me in person he was already a member of houseSYSTEM's facebook.

Here's the timeline of events from my company's trademark proceedings which were filed based in part on the claim (at the time, which has now been settled) that "facebook" is a generic term, as others have discussed here.

http://www.thinkpress.com/authoritas/timeline.pdf

If Mark was toying with this idea in April, 2003 (as I was), then he only started really taking it seriously once he saw my progress, which I'd started on independently. Three days after we had dinner he registered thefacebook.com without telling me.

I don't think Ceglia is arguing that he came up with the idea--he was just funding Mark's idea. So essentially Mark and I thought up a solution for the lack of a universal face book at Harvard at the same time, but I actually made mine before he did, and then I asked him for help running it. He turned down my request and instead asked me for help with an unspecified idea, which I declined to help with since he wouldn't tell me anything and had just been disciplined for ignoring privacy issues I considered important.

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#24

Post by hop » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:03 PM UTC

thinkcomp wrote: post #22

I don't know anything about the case, but based on looking at the document, it looks like Mark's signature and handwriting to me. I guess it could have been copied from something else, though.

Is there a copy of that document floating around?

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#25

Post by keltex » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:20 PM UTC

Timothee wrote: post #8

nkassis wrote: post #2

This is going to be interesting. If this guy wins, facebook is going to have a hell of a time surviving with uncertainty at the top.

That is, if his claim has any truth to it and if he doesn't settle out of court, which might be likely to happen considering what is at stake. (cf. previous Facebook lawsuits) I'm definitely curious about how that kind of things are handled, where a previous contract appears out of nowhere, completely changing how later contracts and investments would have happened.

If the previous contract is deemed valid, then the later contracts are usually "breached" and they can sue for damages. This means that the first investors all the way until through the latest investors have contracts signed by Zuckerberg or company executives stating the beneficial ownership. And this ownership is no longer accurate.

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#26

Post by grellas » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:29 PM UTC

nano81 wrote: post #10

tamarindo wrote: post #6

Facebook claims Ceglia remained silent for more than six years and his claim is probably too old to pursue. Have any independent legal experts corroborated Facebook's statement that "his claim is too old to pursue"?

grellas' analysis from the original article here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1509512

Just one additional note:

The only reason this case got headlines was because a judge entered a TRO and this usually signifies that a case has merit of some kind. This case is an exception, however, as explained in my comment linked to above (explaining why the case has serious problems).

As a follow up, upon removal of the case to federal court, the TRO has essentially already been dissolved: see http://www.allfacebook.com/2010/07/facebook-asset-freeze-str....

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#27

Post by Elite » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:33 PM UTC

hop wrote: post #24

thinkcomp wrote: post #22

I don't know anything about the case, but based on looking at the document, it looks like Mark's signature and handwriting to me. I guess it could have been copied from something else, though.

Is there a copy of that document floating around?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/34239119/Ceglia-v-Zuckerberg-compl...

2003 Contract starts on page 11

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#28

Post by bosch » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:34 PM UTC

jrockway wrote: post #3

They should hire Lisa's brother, Bart, as co-counsel.

I thought that was pretty funny. I don't understand the harshness with which people vote down jokes on here.

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#29

Post by Elite » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:37 PM UTC

thinkcomp wrote: post #23

Elite wrote: post #14

According to the above Bloomberg Article: Ceglia claims his alleged contract, which refers to " The Face Book " was signed about nine months before Facebook was founded, the company said in court papers. According to the NYT from 2007: http://nyti.ms/cC0HwJ "An e-mail message, circulated widely by Mr. Greenspan to Harvard students on Sept. 19, 2003, describes the newest feature of houseSYSTEM, as " The Face Book " an…

Hi. I'd never heard of Ceglia until a few days ago. Mark certainly didn't tell me about him, just like he didn't tell me about the Winklevosses. By the time Mark talked to me in person he was already a member of houseSYSTEM's facebook. Here's the timeline of events from my company's trademark proceedings which were filed based in part on the claim (at the time, which has now been settled) that "facebook" is a generic…

"had just been disciplined for ignoring privacy issues I considered important"

Details?

Re: Facebook Lawyer `Unsure' Whether Founder Mark Zuckerberg Signed Contract

#30

Post by joubert » Tue, Jul 20, 2010, 11:37 PM UTC

jrockway wrote: post #21

obsaysditto wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think most users will care about this? They'll just want to know if they can still see what their friends are doing, who has posted new photos, etc.

What if the new owner decides to "generate revenue" by selling your personal information to the highest bidder, and then turns the site off? Reselling the information is cheaper than keeping a bunch of programmers and sysadmins employed, after all.

class action lawsuit perhaps?