A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich • Hacker News Board

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#21

Post by athenot » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:38 PM UTC

justboxing wrote: post #13

self-diversity wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What in particular makes you feel ill about this? What is the strong emotion that affects you so upon reading of the wealth of a person you will never meet? Normally when people say this, their tone makes it evident they are envious, but that's missing here and I'm curious.

I'm not envious. I want to understand why such wealthy people wouldn't spend the money improving the lives of other human beings, and instead waste it on overprices sh*t like a $12,000 Hermes bag. I grew up in India and the wealth disparity couldn't be any starker. I feel that if I was ever that wealthy, I would spend a lot of it trying to improve the lives of poor people and homeless people, instead of buying 4000 s…

I would attribute that to a desire to raise oneself up at the expense of the others, stemming from basic lack of empathy and belief in superiority. This is often justified through societal constructs (economy, profession, race, caste…)

PS: cool boxing site! :)

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#22

Post by huehehue » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:39 PM UTC

self-diversity wrote: post #6

justboxing wrote: post #4

> In another, Imelda Marcos, the former first lady of the Philippines accused of stealing billions from state coffers, sits in her Manila apartment beneath a gold-framed Picasso Everytime I read something like this, I feel ill. What drives human beings to this level of greed and excess? Is there some primitive or primate instinct in all of us? Meanwhile, the beggar children in India don't even have a shirt on their b…

What in particular makes you feel ill about this? What is the strong emotion that affects you so upon reading of the wealth of a person you will never meet? Normally when people say this, their tone makes it evident they are envious, but that's missing here and I'm curious.

Ironic that you're being downvoted for prompting half the discussion in this thread (at present).

I'm curious about this, too. Sibling comments are asking why any person or company would hoard that money when they could be donating it. A company I know just spent over a $1M USD on a domain name and got a lot of hate for it -- many complaints that the money could have been donated instead.

For reference, I grew up dirt poor, and still work insane hours every day in a continual effort to dig myself out of a pit I never asked to be in. And I still don't think it's fair to criticize how private entities spend their own money. I absolutely understand leveling the playing field, and using a position of privilege to benefit society. But if I get rich and blow my fortune on luxury goods so what?

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#23

Post by Banthum » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:40 PM UTC

I really wish people would stop using the term "1%" to refer to the super-rich. They're actually talking about the 0.01%, or an even smaller group.

Heck, anyone making $30k/year is in the 1% globally. Even in the West, a good (not superstar) doctor or lawyer can expect to be in the 1%. If you're buying $300k handbags, you're way, way, way beyond the 1%.

II

Documentary works like this, mixing avaricious fascination with super-wealth as well as the morally-delicious feeling of superiority, always put me off a bit. It's sort of like the inverse of watching Hoarders - you get to be horrified and fascinated and feel superior at the same time.

"How could someone live like this?" you get to say. "I would never..." you get to say.

(Not saying that this photographer had that intention, specifically - I'm more commenting on the audience than the photog).

People are people; wealth is wealth; most people would act in these ways if they could.

And from the point of view of a kid starving in Delhi slums, your Prius looks a lot like Imelda Marcos' gold-framed Picasso.

That said... I'm looking at these photos with interest :)

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#24

Post by svieira » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:41 PM UTC

self-diversity wrote: post #6

justboxing wrote: post #4

> In another, Imelda Marcos, the former first lady of the Philippines accused of stealing billions from state coffers, sits in her Manila apartment beneath a gold-framed Picasso Everytime I read something like this, I feel ill. What drives human beings to this level of greed and excess? Is there some primitive or primate instinct in all of us? Meanwhile, the beggar children in India don't even have a shirt on their b…

What in particular makes you feel ill about this? What is the strong emotion that affects you so upon reading of the wealth of a person you will never meet? Normally when people say this, their tone makes it evident they are envious, but that's missing here and I'm curious.

Not the poster, but for my part, the reason I find this kind of behavior revolting is that it is clear to me that material goods are intended for all; though men have a right to private property, that right is not to all property, but to sufficient property to provide for their needs and their state in life, and all else kept after that is waste.

> Moreover, the earth, even though apportioned among private owners, ceases not thereby to minister to the needs of all, inasmuch as there is not one who does not sustain life from what the land produces.

> When what necessity demands has been supplied, and one's standing fairly taken thought for, it becomes a duty to give to the indigent out of what remains over.

http://w2.vatican.va/content/leo-xiii/en/encyclicals/documen...

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#25

Post by mncharity » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:41 PM UTC

gmarx wrote: post #2

When Fortune (or was it Forbes) introduced the list of 500 richest Americans (early 1970s?) many people on the list were angry and threatened to sue. Now it's honor, a form a celebrity

As was pointed out by a long-ago HN comment I've now failed to find, the tabloid "richest" lists measure particularly public forms of wealth. People who don't wish to be on such lists, now manage their wealth so they're not.

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#26

Post by jondubois » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:44 PM UTC

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #14

justboxing wrote: post #4

> In another, Imelda Marcos, the former first lady of the Philippines accused of stealing billions from state coffers, sits in her Manila apartment beneath a gold-framed Picasso Everytime I read something like this, I feel ill. What drives human beings to this level of greed and excess? Is there some primitive or primate instinct in all of us? Meanwhile, the beggar children in India don't even have a shirt on their b…

Hoarding during scarcity is quite a sensible strategy, you want to get through the winter season or drought. What we don't seem able to do is turn that off in an environment of abundance. We can't seem to get past that evolutionary adaptation and it isn't doing us any good.

Some people are genetically greedier than others and greedier people are much more likely to get into positions of power.

To make matters worse, people tend to like people who are like them. So greedy people help other greedy people. This means that power and money becomes concentrated in the hands of the greedy.

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#27

Post by Mendenhall » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:46 PM UTC

I think part of the problem is how often people idolize the rich just for being rich and not for what sort of person they are, it enables them.

Money doesnt impress me, good people impress me.

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#28

Post by pjc50 » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:47 PM UTC

self-diversity wrote: post #6

justboxing wrote: post #4

> In another, Imelda Marcos, the former first lady of the Philippines accused of stealing billions from state coffers, sits in her Manila apartment beneath a gold-framed Picasso Everytime I read something like this, I feel ill. What drives human beings to this level of greed and excess? Is there some primitive or primate instinct in all of us? Meanwhile, the beggar children in India don't even have a shirt on their b…

What in particular makes you feel ill about this? What is the strong emotion that affects you so upon reading of the wealth of a person you will never meet? Normally when people say this, their tone makes it evident they are envious, but that's missing here and I'm curious.

It's dysfunctional, like a human version of the "paperclip maximizer" AI: https://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Paperclip_maximizer

Musk with his personal space programme at least makes "sense" of some sort. Imelda bought more shoes than she could wear in a lifetime: that's dysfunctional.

And it came with a real human cost. How many human QALYs did that collection cost the Philipines? Or, more personally, how many dead children is a Picasso worth?

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#29

Post by gmarx » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:51 PM UTC

clort wrote: post #15

gmarx wrote: post #2

When Fortune (or was it Forbes) introduced the list of 500 richest Americans (early 1970s?) many people on the list were angry and threatened to sue. Now it's honor, a form a celebrity

people are still sueing Forbes http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-saudi-billionaire-idUSBRE9560Q020130607

Ha!

Re: A Look at the Ugly Side of Getting Rich

#30

Post by gmarx » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 7:52 PM UTC

vkou wrote: post #9

gmarx wrote: post #2

When Fortune (or was it Forbes) introduced the list of 500 richest Americans (early 1970s?) many people on the list were angry and threatened to sue. Now it's honor, a form a celebrity

That was in the age of the Red Scare. These people had reason to be seriously concerned that they may find themselves on the wrong end of a torch and pitchfork.

Maybe but it was also towards the end of an age when people generally considered it to be in poor taste to talk about money.