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Envoy: 7 months later

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Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#21

Post by sandGorgon »

gtirloni wrote: post #9
sandGorgon wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Linkerd has been a pretty cool piece of tech. In fact, their rewrite linkerd-tcp is in Rust and is blazingly fast. Also, it works on L4 and can do more stuff than Envoy... though I think that advantage is going to be shortlived. Linkerd guys have been focusing on building deep integration with k8s (as an ingress or sidecar), but this announcement of Envoy trumps it all. > "We are excited to announce that we are…

Isn't linkerd in Scala and linkerd-tcp a small subset of it?

that's true - but i was hopeful !

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#22

Post by politician »

moondev wrote: post #16

Interesting that it seems like there is a bunch of overlap with linkerd in the k8s space. With both k8s and linkerd being CNCF projects, I wonder why google is putting so many resources behind envoy rather than linkerd. I guess that's the beauty of the k8s ecosystem though, freedom and choice to use what you see fit. K8s just provides the rock-solid primitives.

linkerd has a dependency on the JVM, k8s doesn't, and not everyone wants to pull in the JVM if they're not already using it.

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#23

Post by henrikschroder »

shawabawa3 wrote: post #18

Looks interesting except imo the configuration makes it basically unusable. They use jinja2 templated json... and there are hundreds of lines for their "simple" examples. Even the "hello world" type example of proxying to google is a mess https://github.com/lyft/envoy/blob/master/configs/google_com...

I love how history repeats itself.

I remember everyone complaining about Spring and similar having these massive XML configuration files, and then people said "never again!", and moved to very simple JSON formats for their frameworks. And then everyone adds a little bit to the best practices, and over time we get this, again.

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#24

Post by aledbf »

tedd4u wrote: post #6

There was a very interesting talk at Google Next in March that described a way in which the Kubernetes open source team is bringing this sidecar architecture to Kub. In fact I think they are working with the Lyft team. The whole talk is interesting but I've added a time offset to skip to the bit where they talk about sidecar/service mesh. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3quCoi5YHz4#t=27m59s Also, there is https://ist…

You can find the project here https://github.com/istio/manager

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#25

Post by stock_toaster »

bastawhiz wrote: post #20
shawabawa3 wrote: post #18

Looks interesting except imo the configuration makes it basically unusable. They use jinja2 templated json... and there are hundreds of lines for their "simple" examples. Even the "hello world" type example of proxying to google is a mess https://github.com/lyft/envoy/blob/master/configs/google_com...

The example you linked isn't so bad. Perhaps a bit verbose for a simple example. The formatting of the json is ugly though, and I think they would do better to not collapse the whitespace inside arrays.

Seems like they could have used something a bit nicer to work with too (yaml, libucl, hocon, etc). I am honestly getting tired of editing fiddly json (no comments, last element in list can't have a comma, etc) all over the place.

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#26

Post by Spiritus »

politician wrote: post #22
moondev wrote: post #16

Interesting that it seems like there is a bunch of overlap with linkerd in the k8s space. With both k8s and linkerd being CNCF projects, I wonder why google is putting so many resources behind envoy rather than linkerd. I guess that's the beauty of the k8s ecosystem though, freedom and choice to use what you see fit. K8s just provides the rock-solid primitives.

linkerd has a dependency on the JVM, k8s doesn't, and not everyone wants to pull in the JVM if they're not already using it.

I guess that's one the reasons they created https://github.com/linkerd/linkerd-tcp

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#27

Post by user5994461 »

stock_toaster wrote: post #25
bastawhiz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The example you linked isn't so bad. Perhaps a bit verbose for a simple example. The formatting of the json is ugly though, and I think they would do better to not collapse the whitespace inside arrays.

Seems like they could have used something a bit nicer to work with too (yaml, libucl, hocon, etc). I am honestly getting tired of editing fiddly json (no comments, last element in list can't have a comma, etc) all over the place.

You can use hjson for human editable json.

http://hjson.org/try.html

Human editable json, with comments, and doesn't kill you for a lack of trailing comma.

Available libraries in tons of languages.

Re: Envoy: 7 months later

#28

Post by wstrange »

stock_toaster wrote: post #25
bastawhiz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The example you linked isn't so bad. Perhaps a bit verbose for a simple example. The formatting of the json is ugly though, and I think they would do better to not collapse the whitespace inside arrays.

Seems like they could have used something a bit nicer to work with too (yaml, libucl, hocon, etc). I am honestly getting tired of editing fiddly json (no comments, last element in list can't have a comma, etc) all over the place.

Given Google's involvement, I am wondering why they did not choose jsonnet?
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