Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy • Hacker News Board

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#21

Post by tptacek » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:33 PM UTC

pgodzin wrote: post #11

alva wrote: post #3

Regarding the Fake News section and trust in media. I would love to see a tool or company that holds the mainstream news sources accountable. Over the last two days the major news sources have been pushing a blatantly false "truth" ("Muslim Ban"). Intention of this post is not to get into a political discussion of this! Every time I, as a heavy news consumer, see the BBC, NYT etc push a story which I know to be false…

"Fake News" is completely making things up facts like "Trump punched the Pope today" for the sake of clicks. Calling recent actions as a "Muslim ban" is an interpretation of real events, including quotes by Rudy Giuliani and Flynn's son calling it a "Muslim ban" themselves. I would not consider it fake news, just an order executed with enough plausible deniability that they can prey on people's newfound obsession wit…

Just to follow this up for people skimming:

A high-profile author of the policy is on camera --- video you can easily find for yourself --- saying that they were tasked with devising a Muslim ban, and that he is proud of the legal chicanery they employed to make it "legal".

This subthread, of course, an entirely off-topic divergence from the subject at hand.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#22

Post by alva » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:33 PM UTC

random28345 wrote: post #16

alva wrote: post #3

Regarding the Fake News section and trust in media. I would love to see a tool or company that holds the mainstream news sources accountable. Over the last two days the major news sources have been pushing a blatantly false "truth" ("Muslim Ban"). Intention of this post is not to get into a political discussion of this! Every time I, as a heavy news consumer, see the BBC, NYT etc push a story which I know to be false…

> Over the last two days the major news sources have been pushing a blatantly false "truth" ("Muslim Ban"). Intention of this post is not to get into a political discussion of this! Well, if you're going to try to build a mechanism to hold the mainstream media accountable, you'll really need to create a standard on when a summarization is inaccurate. If the media was reporting on, "a ban on travelers from majority Mu…

>"a ban on travelers from majority Muslim countries by a president who has promised his supporters a ban on Muslims" would that still be misleading?

That would be a very accurate summary. Not misleading in the slightest.

>" And if opponents of the ban called it a "Muslim ban", would media outlets be allowed to report on that fact?"

Absolutely, but it should not be presented as fact that "Donald Trump has enacted a Muslim Ban". "People have described this as a Muslim Ban" is a fair representation.

>For the record, I've seen NYT and BBC call this a "travel ban", "Trump's ban" and in quotes designed to indicate attribution "'Muslim ban'". All of these seem reasonable and factual

That is far more responsible. However if you google news search Muslim Ban on the day it was announced, this is Not what the majority of news sources were doing.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#23

Post by baron816 » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:33 PM UTC

I think an important question to ask with regards to Democracy is "why do people believe the things they believe" or "how do they acquire their political beliefs?" The biggest influencers are likely 1) their family and 2) their friends. Essentially, they come from social interaction.

People need a (fun) way to increase the number of real social interactions they have with other people. What's really dangerous right now is that many (including Liberals) are socially shunning those who don't share their political beliefs (or are not pure enough in their beliefs). Pushing people to the fringes of society will just force them to find a home in the most extreme among us.

For a long time, Americans relied on social clubs that allowed people to engage in diverse political discussions but also build friendly relationships with others. I would like to see startups try to revive long lived, persistent social organizations that are aimed first at building a friendly community among its members and second at making people listen to different points of view.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#24

Post by mtgx » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:34 PM UTC

For startups working on improving democracy, I'd suggest you start helping these three groups in any way you can:

http://www.fairvote.org/

https://represent.us/

http://www.wolf-pac.com/

Creating a more fair representation in government that doesn't only involve the duopoly parties as well as getting money out politics should be the two main priorities before anything else. Unless these two things are fixed first, everything else will continue to be broken.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tu32CCA_Ig

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw2z9lV3W1g

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#25

Post by burkaman » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:35 PM UTC

cazum wrote: post #18

alva wrote: post #3

Regarding the Fake News section and trust in media. I would love to see a tool or company that holds the mainstream news sources accountable. Over the last two days the major news sources have been pushing a blatantly false "truth" ("Muslim Ban"). Intention of this post is not to get into a political discussion of this! Every time I, as a heavy news consumer, see the BBC, NYT etc push a story which I know to be false…

Without derailing too much here, can you point me to a non-op-ed story published by a mainstream news source that calls it a "Muslim ban"?

I think this is the only relevant point here. For example, the Washington Post has only referred to it as a "travel ban". The phrase "Muslim ban" appears in opinion headlines, or a couple times when it is directly stated to be a quote. The New York Times uses "travel ban" and "immigration ban". It is newsworthy than members of congress and many organizations have called it a "Muslim ban" but news organizations are not directly using that phrase.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#26

Post by alva » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:35 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #21

pgodzin wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Fake News" is completely making things up facts like "Trump punched the Pope today" for the sake of clicks. Calling recent actions as a "Muslim ban" is an interpretation of real events, including quotes by Rudy Giuliani and Flynn's son calling it a "Muslim ban" themselves. I would not consider it fake news, just an order executed with enough plausible deniability that they can prey on people's newfound obsession wit…

Just to follow this up for people skimming: A high-profile author of the policy is on camera --- video you can easily find for yourself --- saying that they were tasked with devising a Muslim ban, and that he is proud of the legal chicanery they employed to make it "legal". This subthread, of course, an entirely off-topic divergence from the subject at hand.

Yes you are right that he had done so. And if he had signed into law a ban people coming to the country based on their religion, then the papers plastering "Trump enacts Muslim Ban" would be accurate. But that is not the case.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#27

Post by mtgx » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:38 PM UTC

alva wrote: post #3

Regarding the Fake News section and trust in media. I would love to see a tool or company that holds the mainstream news sources accountable. Over the last two days the major news sources have been pushing a blatantly false "truth" ("Muslim Ban"). Intention of this post is not to get into a political discussion of this! Every time I, as a heavy news consumer, see the BBC, NYT etc push a story which I know to be false…

If only the mainstream media would stick to following these principles enumerated here, rather than blatantly taking sides (even when it's unnecessary for them to do so):

https://www.popehat.com/2016/12/15/deserving-trust/

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#28

Post by moflome » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:38 PM UTC

@sama I'm heartened to see "Jobs" included in this list, but can you clarify whether this is a change in investment focus - will you be giving priority to startups which have greatest potential for job creation? If so, how would you qualify / prioritize those jobs (ie., part-time, full-time, educational requirements)?

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#29

Post by alva » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:39 PM UTC

pgodzin wrote: post #17

alva wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah me either as it is off topic. But in response, it is not a ban on people of one religion entering the country. It is a ban on people from 7 terror prone countries entering. For the passing news consumer, it would be very easy to be led to believe that Muslims are banned from entering the US.

A ban on 7 Muslim-majority countries with exceptions for minority religions. In addition: "I’ll tell you the whole history of it: When he first announced it, he said ‘Muslim ban,'" Giuliani said on Fox News. "He called me up, he said, ‘Put a commission together, show me the right way to do it legally.’" source: http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/316726-giuliani-t...

Does any of that change the hard facts that what was enacted is not a ban on people coming to the US based on their religion. Because that is the pure fact.

Re: Request for Startups: News, Jobs, and Democracy

#30

Post by tptacek » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:40 PM UTC

A category of applications that I'd like to see YC helping along are those things that could help ordinary people run for office. The things off the top of my head I can see technology helping with:

* Leveraging social networking to generate social permission for people to stand for office, which I think is the most important obstacle facing people who might consider running --- far more so than money.

* Using technology to bypass the expensive outreach vectors traditional candidates are stuck with.

* Informing constituencies and potential candidates about the local offices available to run for.

* Crowdfunding campaigns with Kickstarter-like dynamics to make it safer to commit funds to speculative candidates.

* Capturing the stories of people who have or are standing for election, so that we can all compare notes and see what the challenges (or lack thereof) are.

* Building informal parties and coalitions of officeholders in states and major metro areas, to build tickets and slates of candidates around common ideals.

* Building common platforms for constituent services, so that fresh new officeholders can outcompete incumbents both in responsiveness and in making their newfound influence available to their constituencies to pressure other parts of government.

I've been calling my Senators about the Sessions nomination nonstop for the past 2 weeks and I've gotten calls through just 3 times. I haven't the slightest clue how to reach officeholders in my Chicago suburb. Clearly there's room for major innovation here.

Incidentally, if you're building things like this, I'd love to help in any way I can. I'm easy to contact. I've set a goal for myself to get a specific number of friends and acquaintances to run, and I'm happy with the progress I've been able to make and pretty excited about the concept.