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Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

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Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's hundreds of things that can be done to chip away at them. A pet peeve of mine is certificate of need laws: http://www.ncsl.org/research/health/con-certificate-of-need-... The notion is to reduce capital expenditures and save costs, but they are a big part of why the hospital in the article can get away with charging so much for cat scans -- there's no competition. Of course it is going to be difficult to go t…

Seems like what you're saying is, we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. If we allow hospitals to build out as much as they want, they'll be underutilized and will have to raise prices to cover their capital costs; if we restrict them with CON laws, lack of competition will allow them to raise prices anyway. Given that, I don't see how CON laws are either the problem or the solution. The problem seems to be mo…

I acknowledged that some; I'm pretty sure they shouldn't apply anymore to CT machines. Creates a profit center for the hospital with little or no offsetting benefit to the public.

Whole hospitals is harder to say, but build out will be treated like any other investment, not done willy-nilly, and a hospital going out of business is probably better over the medium term than a hospital being propped up by limiting market entry.

There are good reasons to maintain levels of service geographically, but for stuff like that we should be doing direct grants, not obstructing markets and hoping it works out the way we want.

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#22
These debates about insurance and payment models are important, but still ignore the biggest issue. US healthcare expenses increasingly go to treating conditions caused by poor lifestyle choices: obesity, substance abuse, and sedentary lifestyles. Certainly there are ways to cut waste and shift costs around more equitably but unless we can improve those root cause factors we're only going to be kicking the can down the road. At some point we just won't be able to provide effective care to everyone regardless of who's paying or how much providers cut prices.

Even countries with socialized medicine are going to run into the same issue. Canada and the UK are only slightly better off in those lifestyle choice factors than the US, and their trends are moving in the wrong direction.

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#23
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe it should be that way, however in practice it doesn't work. The ACA specifically requires free preventive services because research has shown that when patients have to pay they often skip it. And when they skip preventive care that causes the spread of infectious diseases, and allows small problems to turn into serious problems that are more difficult and expensive to treat. So this is important from a public…

Preventative care that actually works is super cheap and not controversial (mostly vaccinations). This idea that we can save vast sums via preventative care is a fantasy. You may find anecdotes to support it, but the serious literature doesn't bear it out.

> Preventative care that actually works is super cheap

The same's true about car maintenance, but plenty of people drive on dying brake pads and stretch oil changes anyways. A hundred bucks for a checkup is still more than many folks are willing to pay. As an example, here's a kid who died for want of a $80 dental procedure: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02...

> not controversial (mostly vaccinations)

LOL.

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#24

I came across this last night and stayed up too late reading it. It's a fascinating exposé of where at least a good part of the money is going -- the extra money that we Americans spend on health care that doesn't bring us any better outcomes. I think it's relevant to HN because a lot of us with families and/or in middle age can't risk quitting our jobs to start startups without assurance that we'll be able to buy ad…

The idea that Trump is unencumbered by campaign contributions is a pipe dream, because he has to buy the loyalty of Congress in order to pass laws, and they are more encumbered than ever.

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#25
post #22

These debates about insurance and payment models are important, but still ignore the biggest issue. US healthcare expenses increasingly go to treating conditions caused by poor lifestyle choices: obesity, substance abuse, and sedentary lifestyles. Certainly there are ways to cut waste and shift costs around more equitably but unless we can improve those root cause factors we're only going to be kicking the can down t…

>US healthcare expenses increasingly go to treating conditions caused by poor lifestyle choices: obesity, substance abuse, and sedentary lifestyles.

Nice rhetoric, but source?

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#27
post #22

These debates about insurance and payment models are important, but still ignore the biggest issue. US healthcare expenses increasingly go to treating conditions caused by poor lifestyle choices: obesity, substance abuse, and sedentary lifestyles. Certainly there are ways to cut waste and shift costs around more equitably but unless we can improve those root cause factors we're only going to be kicking the can down t…

Victim blaming and false. End of life medical treatment (I wouldn't call it "care") is an enormously expensive and often ghoulish practice.

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#28
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know that Paul Ryan's opinion matters too much at this point. I also am not sure the Democrats could do single-payer even if they had the White House and Congress. They take plenty of money from the special interests too.

The democrats couldn't do it when they had WH and Congress... they had to go with Plan B - "Obamacare". Personally, I believe that Plan B was written to fail. Government creates problems. How do you solve the problem? More government. Obamacare, imho, was created as the groundwork for single payer. I just don't think they expected it to fail so hard and so fast. I have no faith in single payer... for example, look at…

Single payer works well in many places other than the US.

People on private insurance plans in the US die or suffer while waiting for care their plans allegedly offer, while executives of those private insurance companies get "lavish bonuses".

Re: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us (2013) [pdf]

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Relevant quote from the article re: what an effective solution needs to achieve: >The real issue isn’t whether we have a single payer or multiple payers. It’s whether whoever pays has a fair chance in a fair market. Congress has given Medicare that power when it comes to dealing with hospitals and doctors, and we have seen how that works to drive down the prices Medicare pays, just as we’ve seen what happens when Con…

I agree with most of this, but > We should outlaw the chargemaster. I don't know how that would work. My thought was to require it to be published.

That's when we built pricepain.com in 2013 ... The article definitly inspired several efforts to allow market forces to operate by facilitating price transparency.
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