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Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

seeedstudio.com

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Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#21

Post by blackguardx »

ajford wrote: post #19
blackguardx wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

pcbcart.com has always been my choice for chinese PCBs. They have really good capabilities compared to budget board houses.

I've never heard of them, but they look pretty competitive on pricing above 4 layers. The benefit of the budget board houses is when you need a small run of boards for prototyping. OSHPark is great when you want a few 2layer boards under say 6 sq inches. DirtyPCB is great for 2 or 4 layer boards under 15sq inches (10cmX10cm size). You can get ten 4-layer boards at 10cmX10cm for $50, where as pcbcart has that for $250

It isn't just layer count. Look at the trace and space capabilities as well as smallest via hole size and annular ring size.

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#22

Post by revelation »

Etheryte wrote: post #7

Since I've ever only done rather simple boards: when would you actually need 16 layers? How complex of a component are we talking about when it would be feasible to use that many layers?

Once you use a BGA with X balls in Y rows and Z columns with so and so pitch the minimum number of layers needed quickly goes way up.

If you use any kind of BGA you will want to start with 4 layers just for signal integrity.

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#23

Post by revelation »

honkhonkpants wrote: post #8

I hope I never see the day I have to route 16 layers.

Technically routing gets easier with more layers available. If a 16 layer board cost the same to manufacture as a 2 layer one I would just always use that.

Of course today they are still magnitudes more expensive so generally such a high layer count means you are routing evil high frequency signals..

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#24

Post by chrisBob »

mmastrac wrote: post #20

Has anyone used their service to build fully-populated boards? I've been dabbling in making boards as a hobby but really don't like the soldering bit at the end. I'd be happy to pay a bit more for it to be done by machines.

Their assembly is reasonable at a few cents per solder joint. I am pretty sure the machine they use is a hard working guy with a soldering iron though. I used it on a small project because they can put down surface mount passive components for less than the cost of the shipping I would pay mouser.

If you can live within their parts library there is no reason not to use it.

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#25

Post by TaylorAlexander »

honkhonkpants wrote: post #13
TaylorAlexander wrote: post #9

I've had over 8000 PCBs produced through Seeed, including 4000 assembled PCBAs, and I'm generally pretty happy with them. I can run a global electronics business out of my apartment because of Seeed. We did have one major production issue where a critical part was substituted for an out of spec part without authorization and without anyone at Seeed knowing about it. [1] That was very frustrating. But once I came up w…

The fact that you can send drawings to be fabricated and get hard goods in the mail days later has been true for years. You could have been running a global electronics business from home for fifteen years now. So what do these guys add over players like pcbexpress, or the innumerable Chinese shops?

Follow up. Another major thing with Seeed is that they have no minimum order quantity for assembly. They'll do 10 or 10,000 PCBAs for you. Lots of other places I quoted had large minimum order quantities. My main products might have met those requirements, but some of my accessories didn't. With Seeed I can do everything in one place.

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#28

Post by jacquesm »

honkhonkpants wrote: post #10
Etheryte wrote: post #7

Since I've ever only done rather simple boards: when would you actually need 16 layers? How complex of a component are we talking about when it would be feasible to use that many layers?

Usually you might need this if your software fails to route with "only" 14 layers.

You might be able to route it but that doesn't mean it will work due to crosstalk and then those additional layers will come in handy as ground.

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#29

Post by paddi91 »

Shameless plug here, we're just working on getting a PCB & assembly service like Seeedstudio to Europe. What we're trying to achieve is to get close to prices from China but with zero quantities. That means you don't have to take care of stock, as soon as you need one we manufacture it. Beside that all manufacturing is done in Germany and we take care of logistics.

Anyone interested take a look at https://go.aisler.net, if you'd like to participate in our beta assembly just drop me a line at patrick@aisler.net

Re: Fusion – One-stop prototyping service for PCBs

#30

Post by jwr »

paddi91 wrote: post #29

Shameless plug here, we're just working on getting a PCB & assembly service like Seeedstudio to Europe. What we're trying to achieve is to get close to prices from China but with zero quantities. That means you don't have to take care of stock, as soon as you need one we manufacture it. Beside that all manufacturing is done in Germany and we take care of logistics. Anyone interested take a look at https://go.aisler.n…

Finally, something being done in Europe! Sign me up. I've been using Seeed, ITEAD & OSHPark for my hobby stuff, and MacroFab for work stuff (eyeing closely PCBng which gets a lot of things right, but doesn't support all my components yet), but all of those have the same problem: shipping. You either pay with time (3 weeks to get your boards back) or with money (>$60 for quick shipping).

I believe there is a lot that can be done to reduce the cost of electronics assembly and I'm very happy to see something happening here in Europe.

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