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WeChat’s world

economist.com

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Re: WeChat’s world

#21

Post by spacehunt »

tluyben2 wrote: post #4

Bit offtopic; For me it shows more, to western apps, how you build an app that always works... with wechat I can do sync and async voice calls, chat and photo sending with any connection, even if it is very slow or intermittend. No western app I have tried, including the actual phone app, does that as well as wechat. I can call, on 2g crappy China Mobile to colleagues in the EU where Skype and Whatsapp will not even…

> I can call, on 2g crappy China Mobile to colleagues in the EU where Skype and Whatsapp will not even connect or send anything over

Are you sure this is not due to the effects of both 1) the GFW and 2) the atrocious traffic shaping Chinese ISPs apply to international connections?

Not sure about Skype, but Whatsapp always works for me even down to 2G, outside of China.

Re: WeChat’s world

#22

Post by joosters »

hiisukun wrote: post #20
joosters wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So don't use it? I'm not sure how your comments reflect on WeChat; it's not like stores are insisting on you paying through the app, or that businesses are forcing you to use WeChat to contact them. It's an added convenience, and it seems people like that.

I only agree in theory. In practice, many small businesses in my area only have a Facebook homepage now (and no other website). Many friends and colleagues solely organise get togethers (farewells, engagement parties, birthdays) on Facebook. There have been quite a few web services I would have tried around the place, but they only supported 'Log in with Facebook' or 'Log in with Google+' or similar. Luckily I have a…

As a facebook avoider myself, I feel your pain! But I am happy with staying away from it, the choice is always there to sign up or not. I find it strange though that people think that these messaging apps are too large and their ecosystems are becoming too powerful, and yet at the same time there seem to be far too many different messaging platforms.

Re: WeChat’s world

#23

Post by yoz-y »

Borating wrote: post #14

What I am worried about is that Facebook/Google/Microsoft/Amazon/Apple are copying the same model [1]. These companies are killing the open web. [1] How China Is Changing Your Internet (The New York Times) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAesMQ6VtK8

The open web is still there. There are just many people that chose to not participate in it. There are still many who do and will probably do so for a long time. The one problem might be funding, but people will always think of something.

Re: WeChat’s world

#24

Post by tluyben2 »

spacehunt wrote: post #21
tluyben2 wrote: post #4

Bit offtopic; For me it shows more, to western apps, how you build an app that always works... with wechat I can do sync and async voice calls, chat and photo sending with any connection, even if it is very slow or intermittend. No western app I have tried, including the actual phone app, does that as well as wechat. I can call, on 2g crappy China Mobile to colleagues in the EU where Skype and Whatsapp will not even…

> I can call, on 2g crappy China Mobile to colleagues in the EU where Skype and Whatsapp will not even connect or send anything over Are you sure this is not due to the effects of both 1) the GFW and 2) the atrocious traffic shaping Chinese ISPs apply to international connections? Not sure about Skype, but Whatsapp always works for me even down to 2G, outside of China.

No because it also works outside China (I live in the mountains of Spain and do a lot of work while walking through said mountains; around a corner suddenly you lose internet and the next it's back; wechat copes with that fine even in a call, whatsapp not so much last I tried); if you compare;

- go on 2g with 1 bar (really bad/intermitted 2g) - upload a photo to a friend on wechat & whatsapp => whatsapp is significantly worse, not to mention Skype which is horrendous

Same goes for audio snippets or voice calling via whatsapp compared to wechat.

In and outside China.

But yes, for messages (text) whatsapp & wechat both work reliably. Skype mixes up and loses messages randomly, even text only ones. Not to mention Slack and Hipchat; those are just funny if you don't have perfect internet.

Disclaimer; I use wechat a lot more for work than whatsapp; whatsapp is more for social contacts which means they are far less critical most of the time.

Re: WeChat’s world

#25

Post by spacehunt »

tluyben2 wrote: post #24
spacehunt wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can call, on 2g crappy China Mobile to colleagues in the EU where Skype and Whatsapp will not even connect or send anything over Are you sure this is not due to the effects of both 1) the GFW and 2) the atrocious traffic shaping Chinese ISPs apply to international connections? Not sure about Skype, but Whatsapp always works for me even down to 2G, outside of China.

No because it also works outside China (I live in the mountains of Spain and do a lot of work while walking through said mountains; around a corner suddenly you lose internet and the next it's back; wechat copes with that fine even in a call, whatsapp not so much last I tried); if you compare; - go on 2g with 1 bar (really bad/intermitted 2g) - upload a photo to a friend on wechat & whatsapp => whatsapp is significan…

Ah you're talking about voice, which I rarely do (as I find voice messages especially annoying, but that's offtopic).

I found Wechat to be a resource hog on my phone, and the few times I've tried it, most recently less than a month ago, I immediately uninstalled it.

Re: WeChat’s world

#26

Post by delegate »

joosters wrote: post #6
delegate wrote: post #3

.. which is terrible. Apps like these (including Facebook) are breaking the Internet. Now it's up to the social network to decide how resources are located (what standards?), who can access them, and for how long, etc. Saw a good video in your Facebook timeline ? Good luck finding it again after you refresh the page. It's a pity how 'the crowd' is now dictating the direction in which technology evolves. By trying to…

So don't use it? I'm not sure how your comments reflect on WeChat; it's not like stores are insisting on you paying through the app, or that businesses are forcing you to use WeChat to contact them. It's an added convenience, and it seems people like that.

I generally try to avoid these services, but it's impossible to not use some of them, because of their monopolistic position.

I have to use Facebook sometimes because people use it to organise events, concerts and other things which are now inaccessible to me unless I use Facebook. Which is terrible.

These services are bad because they are popular and successful and because they try to offer more and more services on top of the 'social' aspect.

>it seems people like that

That's exactly my point. By catering to what the masses 'like', we're slowly closing the door to the 'free Internet', replacing it with a hegemony of "social" networks, owned by big corps.

And people don't just 'like' that - otherwise companies wouldn't have sales and marketing and advertising departments.

They're unwitting players in complex games of chess between these companies and their value to these companies is the tendency to accept subliminal suggestions and then act on those suggestions when they make purchasing decisions. Also called advertising.

Re: WeChat’s world

#27

Post by BoorishBears »

catdog wrote: post #10
delegate wrote: post #3

.. which is terrible. Apps like these (including Facebook) are breaking the Internet. Now it's up to the social network to decide how resources are located (what standards?), who can access them, and for how long, etc. Saw a good video in your Facebook timeline ? Good luck finding it again after you refresh the page. It's a pity how 'the crowd' is now dictating the direction in which technology evolves. By trying to…

This development is backwards, it reverses everything what is great about the Internet and made it such superior and successful. Instead of a network of networks where everyone can freely share information and talk to anybody, even directly via standardized protocols it's going back to heavily centralized systems, to the last bit controlled by a a small set of commercial entities which even do not see the user as a c…

What's outside this "cage" that consumers want?

Re: WeChat’s world

#28

Post by catdog »

joosters wrote: post #18
amelius wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So don't use it? That's an old argument which totally ignores the network effect.

The original argument, and your reply, is also based on ignoring stuff - namely that people are using and liking these apps & services. The network effect that WeChat has is because it is popular. Would you prefer I use the other old argument, which is 'so build your own app then'? Equally frustrating and annoying, yet at the same time is probably the only other way to fight these walled garden apps. Short of banning…

> The original argument, and your reply, is also based on ignoring stuff - namely that people are using and liking these apps & services. The network effect that WeChat has is because it is popular.

And those who don't like it or discover the downsides later (let alone that some downsides may are added later) have to bite the dust because they are locked in.

Re: WeChat’s world

#29

Post by amelius »

catdog wrote: post #11
amelius wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be better if communication technology with more than (say) 1M users would be forced to obey open standards. This is the case for telephony, so why not enforce it for social media as well?

Would be an appropriate measure but I do not have too much hope at the moment for such a clear political move. Later there may come a point where it's too late.

This seems to be a good task for the EFF, https://www.eff.org/

Re: WeChat’s world

#30

Post by runn1ng »

tluyben2 wrote: post #16
runn1ng wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have had a great experience with Telegram app with poor connections. No wonder it's so popular in Asia, Russia and Middle East.

Ah never tried it. I will now :)

I am not sure how is it compared to WeChat. I have no friends from mainland China :/

Compared to LINE - originally Japanes app, popular in these regions - it's a godsend. LINE is terrible.

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