Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds • Hacker News Board

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#21

Post by reflexive » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 5:57 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #14

eternalban wrote: post #9

I had a conversation with a Japanese American artist a couple of years ago on the general topic of the post-WWII infantilization of Japanese culture. I believe we reached a sort of mild agreement that Japan's collective unconscious is still trying to process the shock of being on the receiving end of a nuclear attack.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

The original "Gojira" (Godzilla) in 1954 has been regarded as an expression of the impotence and powerlessness felt by many Japanese after being forced to surrender to the Allies in WW2, and the subsequent American occupation.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/10788996/Godzilla-wh...

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#22

Post by finid » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 5:57 PM UTC

abstractbeliefs wrote: post #4

Before we get into a huge discussion about virginity, it's worth noting that the government isn't actually worried about it. They're worried about fertility rates. Virgins sell more papers though, so lets get that clickbait going.

Well, if people are not banging, that would affect fertility rates too. So in a sense, there's some relationship between the two.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#23

Post by benjohnson » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 5:57 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #14

eternalban wrote: post #9

I had a conversation with a Japanese American artist a couple of years ago on the general topic of the post-WWII infantilization of Japanese culture. I believe we reached a sort of mild agreement that Japan's collective unconscious is still trying to process the shock of being on the receiving end of a nuclear attack.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

There's a corollary theory here in America where the people who lived through the horrors of WWII reacted by raising the next generation to be free spirits interested in enjoying life while they could.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#24

Post by ausjke » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 5:58 PM UTC

immigration will solve all these issues for now? Japan is not alone. In the future I think the babies can be born outside of the womb at some centers in volume per nation/race's needs.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#25

Post by xiaoma » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:03 PM UTC

ausjke wrote: post #24

immigration will solve all these issues for now? Japan is not alone. In the future I think the babies can be born outside of the womb at some centers in volume per nation/race's needs.

Japan is remarkably uninterested in becoming an immigrant country. Guests are treated with warm, well-mannered hospitality but long-term immigrants are neither desired nor able to assimilate. How many other countries are there with a sizable population of 3rd generation foreigners?

Immigration might be a harder sell than dwindling down and disappearing altogether as a nation/culture/race/whatever else is bundled in with being "Japanese".

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#26

Post by scythe » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:11 PM UTC

What is concerning is this:

>Most people surveyed said they want to get married at some point.

This isn't delineated by gender, so I interpret it as meaning that Japanese men and women both want to get married -- but they aren't enough for each other.

>A booming industry surrounds Japan's growing condition of loneliness, a phenomenon at once quite particular to the Japanese, yet also a glimpse into a future where many people live atomized lives mediated exclusively through personal technology.

That modern philosophy tends to devalue (or rather not value) human relationships is the one thing I'm tempted to blame this on:

https://philosophyinseconds.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/the-...

But that is probably personal bias creeping up. Working hours are the popular explanation, but there is an incongruity: most Japanese claim to want to have relationships, so if they thought working hours were the problem then why haven't they complained? And how could they fail to notice something so obvious? If housing prices are the problem, how does this occur when Japan's population has been in decline for forty years?

I've heard of this phenomenon (and similar ones in Western Europe) and I pick up and discard economic explanations like bottles of some alcoholic beverage. But the alarm in the back of my head says that our culture is the problem, and it just happens to be popular in Japan. If that's the case, things will get worse, not better.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#27

Post by eternalban » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:12 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #14

eternalban wrote: post #9

I had a conversation with a Japanese American artist a couple of years ago on the general topic of the post-WWII infantilization of Japanese culture. I believe we reached a sort of mild agreement that Japan's collective unconscious is still trying to process the shock of being on the receiving end of a nuclear attack.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

We were discussing various topics, fashion, film, and graphic arts, and of course, Godzilla:

http://www.oneikathetraveller.com/tokyo-style-and-infantiliz...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_manga#After_World_W...

http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/godzilla-is-our-never-endin...

--

[p.s. edit: this thread got me surfing around and landed on the topic of Kawaii Ambassadors [below], which prompts the thought that another component of this very visible trend in post WWII Japanese culture may be a desire to present a non-threatening global image.]

http://web-japan.org/trends/09_culture/pop090827.html

http://www.japannewbie.com/2010/01/14/state-sponsored-cute-k...

https://youtu.be/qAc3xXEx7lo

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#28

Post by nononosisisi » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:14 PM UTC

xiaoma wrote: post #25

ausjke wrote: post #24

immigration will solve all these issues for now? Japan is not alone. In the future I think the babies can be born outside of the womb at some centers in volume per nation/race's needs.

Japan is remarkably uninterested in becoming an immigrant country. Guests are treated with warm, well-mannered hospitality but long-term immigrants are neither desired nor able to assimilate. How many other countries are there with a sizable population of 3rd generation foreigners ? Immigration might be a harder sell than dwindling down and disappearing altogether as a nation/culture/race/whatever else is bundled in…

It is definitely their choice to remain homogeneous. One way or another that choice will have strong consequences be they good or bad.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#29

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:15 PM UTC

reflexive wrote: post #21

mariodiana wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

The original "Gojira" (Godzilla) in 1954 has been regarded as an expression of the impotence and powerlessness felt by many Japanese after being forced to surrender to the Allies in WW2, and the subsequent American occupation. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/10788996/Godzilla-wh...

[deleted]

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#30

Post by DasIch » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:16 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #15

> There was one clearly positive indicator in the survey: For the first time, the proportion of women returning to work after having their first child in Japan's once notoriously patriarchal society exceeded 50 percent. In all seriousness, if the concern is low birthrates, how is the above a "clearly positive indicator"?

Women, just like men, don't want to all be stay at home parents or pursue a career while being childless.

Quite a lot of people may be even most want both, so as a government you should make that possible. This indicates that the government might be succeeding at that.