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Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

wozniak.ca

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Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#21

Post by youdontknowtho »

"There are a lot of little things that don't match up with what I would consider to be standard development practice, but I'd like to think I'm mature enough to not assume it is wrong simply because it is different from what I know. Injecting some different approaches and learning a lot along the way is part of the enjoyment."

That's something that I keep running into...just because something is different from what you are most comfortable with doesn't mean its wrong. It's just different. It may even have something for you to learn.

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#23

Post by coleca »

zhte415 wrote: post #18
insulanian wrote: post #11

> Part of the reason I took the job ... because I have a fascination with older computer technology. I was also thinking about going the mainframe route, also because general impression is that the mainframe developer earns big bucks. However, when I started exploring the job offers I was surprised that salaries were not that high at all. So why is that impression still around, and do mainframe developers really earn…

Mainframe is possibly the most offshored field there is in enterprise technology. There are masses of roles in India and to a lesser extent China and Phillipines where is offers a stable decent paying career for these countries. That's where the base-line and critical mass of roles are.

Very true. Because these skills are in high demand, my experience has been that employee turnover in the mainframe sector offshore is extremely high. We had a tremendous problem retaining offshore mainframers through the big BPO companies like Wipro, Cognizant, US Technologies, etc. Go through the effort to train them up, and they would get poached in no time because their skills were in such high demand, and the training cycle starts over again.

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#24

Post by insulanian »

zhte415 wrote: post #18
insulanian wrote: post #11

> Part of the reason I took the job ... because I have a fascination with older computer technology. I was also thinking about going the mainframe route, also because general impression is that the mainframe developer earns big bucks. However, when I started exploring the job offers I was surprised that salaries were not that high at all. So why is that impression still around, and do mainframe developers really earn…

Mainframe is possibly the most offshored field there is in enterprise technology. There are masses of roles in India and to a lesser extent China and Phillipines where is offers a stable decent paying career for these countries. That's where the base-line and critical mass of roles are.

That explains some things.

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#26

Post by rollthehard6 »

PeterisP wrote: post #20
sitharus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sort of. The run z/Architecture CPUs which implement a lot of backwards compatibility. In the old days you had various modules you connected with dedicated CPUs for certain tasks, you'd pay more for them. These days they have a bunch of CPUs and the amount of money you pay IBM determines what those CPUs can do. There's no physical difference between the Linux CPU, the DB2 CPU and the Java CPU, they're all the same as…

Ahh, I recall that we ordered an upgrade of the system hardware because we needed 4 more CPUs, and this was accomplished by sending a code that unlocked extra CPUs that had been sitting in our basement all along since the day they installed that system.

At one point Sun had a similar model before RHEL + VMWare ate their lunch - https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19095-01/sfe2900.srvr/819-1269-1...

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#27

Post by StudyAnimal »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #16

What exactly is a "mainframe" in a modern sense? I thought it exclusively referred to old-fashioned big iron. Is it a cluster? Or are we actually talking about quarter-century-old monoliths running ancient, indispensable code?

It refers basically only to the IBM z/Architecture machines. (I think no one else makes them any more. There were some IBM compatible (heh) Japanese ones recently). You can call a cluster of PCs a supercomputer, but you cant call it a mainframe.(But you can run a cluster, or sysplex, of mainframes. It sounds over the top but it is actually quite common.) They are particularly considered mainframes when they run z/OS and work in batch mode especially running CICS or IMS based applications. As soon as it runs linux, or web services, or more interactive things, the same zSeries machine is slightly less mainframy. (Using USS is less mainframy than using TSO or ISPF btw heh)

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#28

Post by krinchan »

zhte415 wrote: post #18
insulanian wrote: post #11

> Part of the reason I took the job ... because I have a fascination with older computer technology. I was also thinking about going the mainframe route, also because general impression is that the mainframe developer earns big bucks. However, when I started exploring the job offers I was surprised that salaries were not that high at all. So why is that impression still around, and do mainframe developers really earn…

Mainframe is possibly the most offshored field there is in enterprise technology. There are masses of roles in India and to a lesser extent China and Phillipines where is offers a stable decent paying career for these countries. That's where the base-line and critical mass of roles are.

Furthermore, lately IBM has literally bought Mainframe developers off of other companies. My employer several years ago pink-slipped their entire AS400 work force. Immediately, IBM showed up with job offers for all of them at a severe price cut as contractors. Then, for 5 years, they laid off 25% of them until all that was left were the cheapest, unmotivated code drones that would bill maximum hours and not ask for raises.

I've heard similar stories all over from companies on Mainframe/AS400 platforms. It's totally anecdotal, but at this point it's pretty in character from IBM these days.

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#29

Post by stillworks »

PeterisP wrote: post #20
sitharus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sort of. The run z/Architecture CPUs which implement a lot of backwards compatibility. In the old days you had various modules you connected with dedicated CPUs for certain tasks, you'd pay more for them. These days they have a bunch of CPUs and the amount of money you pay IBM determines what those CPUs can do. There's no physical difference between the Linux CPU, the DB2 CPU and the Java CPU, they're all the same as…

Ahh, I recall that we ordered an upgrade of the system hardware because we needed 4 more CPUs, and this was accomplished by sending a code that unlocked extra CPUs that had been sitting in our basement all along since the day they installed that system.

IBM do the same for P series as well. You get the privilege of purchasing an 8 core server but you only get the rights to use 4 cores. It's your responsibility to pay IBM when comes the time to be able to use all the 8 cores. Organized crime of sorts... like democracy

Re: Mainframes as a lifestyle choice

#30

Post by snaky »

digi_owl wrote: post #15

The more i learn about mainframes (and minicomputers) the more i feel that the PC world is basically rediscovering old ideas as ICs become ever more potent.

Not only ICs, the very idea of The Cloud is basically the mainframe as it always was.
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