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Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

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Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#21

Post by sjwright »

mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

Speaking entirely out of ignorance, how might these policies benefit someone like yourself?

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#22

Post by bunderbunder »

swehner wrote: post #4

First amendment, for sure. I'm guessing this is about this, "The new law would require Airbnb and other short-term rental websites to post registration numbers on listings or email the number and name of the host to the Office of Short-Term Rentals, The City’s agency tasked with enforcing the regulations." (From http://www.sfexaminer.com/sf-poised-require-airbnb-list-regi... ) So "their" "free speech rights" are "vio…

If they win this case, I'm starting a betting pool on how long it is until some corporation claims that reporting employee income to the IRS violates free speech.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#23

Post by jedberg »

sjwright wrote: post #21
mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

Speaking entirely out of ignorance, how might these policies benefit someone like yourself?

People who buy housing just to rent out on AirBnB would find it more economical to rent out to a long term renter (because the licensing is actually less onerous), thereby increasing the rental supply and lowering rents.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#24

Post by mc32 »

sjwright wrote: post #21
mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

Speaking entirely out of ignorance, how might these policies benefit someone like yourself?

By disallowing properties which would otherwise be put on the rental market strictly on ab&b thus arguably subtracting this unit out from the rental market.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#25

Post by sp332 »

mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

But your neighbors might not want you to let out your place to an endless parade of strangers. This is a case where the government needs to listen to the people, and determine if the majority want more freedom or a nicer neighborhood.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#26

Post by bpodgursky »

aaroninsf wrote: post #19
JoshTriplett wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on your point of view. It's also detrimental to society if every new idea has to prove its viability while following the rules written for (and often purchased by) the previous generation of technology. It'd be a lot easier to get stuck in local maxima that way. Some ideas would never get traction, because getting the rules changed requires power and traction in the first place.

I would submit that this maxim does not well apply to the business model of AirBnB, Lyft, Uber, and the like. They do not IMO represent an interesting application of technology. Just the profits of exploiting lag time between what is possible, and what is 'burdened' by consumer and labor protections. I.e.: the industries they have moved into are highly regulated for pretty transparent reasons. Their MO works well unt…

Seriously?

Uber had not proven how much of a quality-of-life improvement it was for users, there is absolutely 0% chance that any city councils would have reformed taxi laws and made explicit exceptions for them, sight-unseen.

They are only BARELY at the point where their critical mass of users can force city governments to give them a legal path (see: de Blasio in NYC), and even that doesn't always work (see: Austin).

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#27

Post by mc32 »

sp332 wrote: post #25
mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

But your neighbors might not want you to let out your place to an endless parade of strangers. This is a case where the government needs to listen to the people, and determine if the majority want more freedom or a nicer neighborhood.

True enough. They might also only want single family homes to be owner or family occupied only. I think there can be compromises people come to.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#28

Post by HarryHirsch »

snappy173 wrote: post #10
bpodgursky wrote: post #8

Free speech rights are a stretch here. I wonder if you could make a viable case for the 3rd amendment though (to my knowledge it has never been done). Strictly interpreted, the 3rd amendment prevents the government from being able to force homeowners to quarter soldiers. If you think about the real intent of the bill though, it's obvious that the mindset is "you are free to use your own house without government inter…

>Strictly interpreted, the 3rd amendment prevents the government from being able to force homeowners to quarter soldiers. If you think about the real intent of the bill though, it's obvious that the mindset is "you are free to use your own house without government interference." that's a real stretch. that would nullify all zoning ...

It is a stretch. If the Founding Fathers had meant to say you are free to use your property without government interference they would have done that.

They had tanneries then, and there is more than a gradual difference between operating a tannery and quartering a bunch of soldiers in someone's house. One interferes with the life of the householder. The other interferes mostly with the life of the neighbours.

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#29

Post by cstejerean »

sp332 wrote: post #25
mc32 wrote: post #17

When does Campoes term out anyway? There certainly is a struggle between ownership rights and the right of cities to regulate business within their jurisdiction. As a renter, I can sympathize with wanting to avail more rental properties to renters, but I am also very uneasy with politicians dictating what you can and cannot do with your property when that act in and of itself is not otherwise illegal. It's not confis…

But your neighbors might not want you to let out your place to an endless parade of strangers. This is a case where the government needs to listen to the people, and determine if the majority want more freedom or a nicer neighborhood.

Then your neighbors should put that in their HOA rules. The city is getting involved to protect hotels not "neighbors".

Re: Airbnb Is Suing San Francisco to Block Rental Rules

#30

Post by ggreer »

swehner wrote: post #4

First amendment, for sure. I'm guessing this is about this, "The new law would require Airbnb and other short-term rental websites to post registration numbers on listings or email the number and name of the host to the Office of Short-Term Rentals, The City’s agency tasked with enforcing the regulations." (From http://www.sfexaminer.com/sf-poised-require-airbnb-list-regi... ) So "their" "free speech rights" are "vio…

It's nothing so silly. As a counterpoint to the Examiner's piece, please read Airbnb's post about the proposed law: https://www.airbnbaction.com/an-update-for-our-community-in-...

Basically, the city wants to hold Airbnb responsible for user-generated content. The city also wants Airbnb to hand over users' personal information. Both the EFF and the Center for Democracy & Technology think that these requirements violate federal law. (Though EPIC thinks otherwise.)

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